Inability to lose title is carebear enough as it is, dont push it. Death count is good. There has to be some sort of death penalty.
Inability to lose title is carebear enough as it is, dont push it. Death count is good. There has to be some sort of death penalty.
It's Apprentice --> Novice btwOriginally Posted by Balneator
the logical progression is quite obviously Novice ---> Apprentice ---> Neophyte, as Novice = Nubvice, Apprentice = Epeentice and Neophyte = No Fight (I'm title hugging)
In both old and new systems
220s "Wakizaka", "Sneakygank", "Wakimango", "Wakisolja", "Tardersauce", "Bushwaki", "Midgetgank", "Bugfixxx", "Ramsbottom", "Paskadoc"
200s Chrisd, Malema, Delbaeth
TL5s Youfail, Bugfixx, Riothamus, Johndee
Proud President of Haven | TL5 PvP
I like these. I am not fond of the current solo rank ideas; they are too similar to each other, and, as others have stated, don't fit in with the overall setting of AO (unless you're an MA). Although, I would flip Assassin and Vindicator, personally. I know that makes a mirror of the alien title level, but...eh.
Unless you guys also let us have the option of displaying our alien rank in a nice green >=P? Since you're already going down the path, why not?
There will be those who dont care about this "penalty" and those who will just continue with what they do now (title hugging) with other means: keep your death-counter as low as possible.
What is your category?
ಠ_ಠ
People WILL make a huge deal about having deaths on their counter... but in PvP now days everyone dies a lot. No one is invicible anymore in my opinion. So everyone should have quite a lot of deaths making it useless to compare. If someone does have more deaths than the next person, it might just mean that they are more dedicated to their side, therefore they have no reason to be ashamed
Agree with the rest about those solo titles seeming bit boring and hard to grasp. So yeah profession specific ones would be nice addition.
ICE COLD! Hehe id love to see that happen.
You are oversimplifying. It doesnt need to be 'death counter' hugging, because you still need to kill and engage in fights to high title, and i personally believe that most pvpers would rather farm kill ratio then care about death ratio. Change like that will not totally remove backyard hugging or running away or any other form of avoiding death. Its just that focus will be now on offensive side.
In general, this looks fantastic - as seems to be the general reaction. Integration of team based PvP is something that I think will revitalize PvP and especially the battlestations (although this is the perfect opportunity to revisit how to let teams onto the battlestation as a team, rather than individuals)
My only concern with the system is that people can never lose titles. I'm sure that you guys have put a ton of thought into that, and I agree with a lot of the reasons you outlined in the discussion of wanting to avoid a death-averse PVP system.
However, if there's no way to ever lose a title in the PvP system, then what you have really introduced isn't a title system, it's another xp system - PvP-xp. Instead of PvP being fun and exciting, it's another grind.
What's worst about it is that in order to avoid the 2% of the server population who plays 24/7 from getting the top PvP title in a week, you'll end up making each title level require exponentially more kills than the last level. The players who are fanatic about the title will find a way to grind it in the smallest time possible, and in your efforts to prevent that, you'll end up making the higher title levels completely unattainable for people who only play an hour or two a day.
I know from the tone of the discussion of the effects of death that these are things you've considered, and I know it's a tough call. However, I do wonder whether you would consider a slight modification to the system, where you gradually lose your PvP-xp over time.
If there is gradual loss (which actually fits in with RP, if you think about it, since true mastery requires constant practice) then the number of kills required for the top titles can be much lower, because it doesn't matter if you achieve the title in 2 weeks, you'll still have to work to keep the title. Similarly, if someone who is a 1-2 hour a day player has a three-day-weekend, or a week off, or something like that, then by doing a lot of PvP during that short time period, they could greatly affect their title during that period, and then it would gradually erode when they went back to having little play time.
It's really fantastic to see you guys addressing the title system, and good luck!
I also like these... and the fact that they raise up to Assassin, they fit well with the idea of SOLO PvP
Agreed. But its a price I'll pay (since I never cared much about the title system anyway) if it gets rid of the title farmers, /afk on BS, and people who go to BS / NW / Tara purely for the titles instead of the gameplay.
Overall I think the changes are a great step forward. Anything can be tweaked, but even if this system wasn't tweaked I'd consider it positive.
And about the grind aspect ... at least its a purely optional grind ... in other words something the people who don't care about can skip without a negative consequence.
Theonara: "...but if I weren't married, some days I'd offer to kiss you. You just make too much sense.
Maeventura: "Sigh, once again I can but only bow for hyde's wisdom."
....• "Social" keys, lightbars, wen-wens......• Better tabbing!
... First Troxdoc with QL300 symbs (AO 17.0 pre-Albtraum guide) ... as well as first with 12 of 13 Alpha symbs.
... First TL1 Clanner with Omni-Armed Forces armor (pics) (pointless yet hawt)
<original UI hacker ... when not actively playing AO ... email = 'hyde [at] athenpaladins • org'>
I also share this same concern.... Namely because of replayability of the content..... once someone has their main maxed out for all PvP titles, there is nothing left to achieve in this current title system.....
How about at least offering, some form of a Title point reset...... currently many people de-level their titles for the challenge of gaining them again...
Well, looking at the other lists and keeping with the theme of progression and coherence in them, and reminiscing a bit on sci-fi stories and old-school AO, I spent a little time coming up with these suggestions:Always open to suggestionsThese were selected as they denote a personal achievement and we couldn't come up with anything 'cool and sci-fi'ish' that we felt was in keeping with a personal achievement. We also wanted to make the different title lists distinctive and clearly different.
Most definitely open to suggestions though as long as they meet those criteria.
-Streetjudge
-Bountyhunter
-Vigilante
-Guerilla
-Commando
-Specialist
-Elite
-Ace
-Nemesis
-Legend
Has an internal coherence and progression, is different from the other title lists, yet not too different, and all are individual-achievement entoned.
On the concern of never losing titles, might it be an idea to let titles decay over time if you do not participate in pvp?
Thor Mastablasta Hammersmith - Level 220, AI 30, LE 70 Clan Atrox Nano Technician - Setup
The Red Brotherhood
I'm a Nano-Technician, don't ever expect me to fight unbuffed, alone or fair.
Means: about f'ing time :P
Satenia: heresy <3
Znore: Mastablasta <3
Kinkstaah: I have agro from many mobs ;(
Madarab: we are aoe class, we are supose to use pistols
Marxgorm: the NT toolset does not fit into my raiding tactics
That or make the top title in each category non-permanent. Meaning, you can lose the top title the same way you can lose any title now. Keeps things a little less static at the top but prevents most of the death avoidance we currently see.
I still prefer a title decay mechanic, it seems to make the most sense.
Last edited by Rewo; Jan 14th, 2008 at 21:14:06.
Mm those Okinawan / Japanese number ranks must go! I feel like we're all MAs with those ranks.
Will there be any true rewards for PVP besides titles? Such as VP - like 5-25 VP per kill depending on their PVP rank vs your rank. Maybe an RP point for getting the top ranks of Combat/Grand Master?
Last edited by Abalz; Jan 14th, 2008 at 21:17:48.
I still prefer profession based as I suggested but if it will be a flat list this is the best so far imho.Well, looking at the other lists and keeping with the theme of progression and coherence in them, and reminiscing a bit on sci-fi stories and old-school AO, I spent a little time coming up with these suggestions:
-Streetjudge
-Bountyhunter
-Vigilante
-Guerilla
-Commando
-Specialist
-Elite
-Ace
-Nemesis
-Legend
Has an internal coherence and progression, is different from the other title lists, yet not too different, and all are individual-achievement entoned.
On the concern of never losing titles, might it be an idea to let titles decay over time if you do not participate in pvp?
PS: Please make titles degrade over time...
That's a pretty nice list of titles. If they don't make it prof. specific (what people seem to want the most) they should use this list. WTB Legend title :P
As I mentioned in past letters, thats a possibility down the line (although I doubt we would ever give rewards per individual kill ) but we won't consider anything like that as part of these first changes. We want to be safe in the knowledge that the system works and is sound before we attach any other benefits to it.
Craig 'Silirrion' Morrison
Old Timer
bump
First I got to say, its great changes!
But! the title names? huh
For the teamlevels, I for one think that the last two, Honored and Hero sounds more like single combat kind of title, unlike some of the other titles such as captain, general, leader and commander (wich should be top title imo
As for the solo titles I would love it being proffesion spesific, and lets take an Enforcer as example:
Froob
Newbie
Gimp
Docker
Worker
Foreman
Union Man
Made Man
Don
Godfather
In other words, just use the proffesions title levels (its only 7,so had to make up some for the 3 first)
Did I mention that I would *love* a Godfather title on my enforcer?
"Bash and smash is the name of me game, and bash and smash is, er, kinda like me name."
You forgot one
Anyways, pull out Nemesis (doesn't fit anyways), and add Destroyer of worlds at the end
(Or just use the titles you have on RK human mobs... ? )
Last edited by Ober; Jan 14th, 2008 at 21:35:53.
Posting Permissions
