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Thread: endgame PvM crit setup

  1. #1

    endgame PvM crit setup

    What gear should I be looking for to run a PvM crit setup? Any and all suggestions welcome, please include nodrop or credit cost information.

  2. #2
    Alot of gear that gives +crit.
    ManiaC DivinE DeluxE
    Divine001 - 220/30/70 - Master

  3. #3
    DD whore I presume ?
    http://auno.org/ao/equip.php?saveid=122682 is your friend. >.<
    Angevil, proud 220 MA from Rimor.
    Flourishing anew. About twelve GUI/Perk/Armor setups done so far, hopefully that one will outlast the criticism of my perfectionism!

    Ars Magna. Histories became artifacts, images of poor effect, memories filled with acts and neglect
    As a vulture of cultures I indeed feed my seeds with much greed, soaked in pleasure I succeed

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by Soliartist View Post
    DD whore I presume ?
    http://auno.org/ao/equip.php?saveid=122682 is your friend. >.<
    I personally wouldn't use the DB sleeves, and surely not the infantry shroud. If you do say 8k crits (in pande, that sounds quite fair) you'll do 3-5k regular, so a rough estimate of 4k damage difference. 1% crit would therefore be equal to 40 damage (and 4 MA skill for the sleeves from trickle). CC has 30 MA which is at the very least 30 damage, + 10 damage + 15 aao. So on the biggest AC mobs, CC will be more than 40 damage. As for shroud, it is about equal to RBP, but half what an eRBP does. So yeah, it's a good setup if you can't afford those items, but if you can, go for CC sleeves/eRBP. (You asked credit cost informations. ;p)
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  5. #5
    Nice DD setup Ange, but it offers little defense. I'd probably use the same if I had all those items and was on a total offensive setup, except for the db sleeves, which when I tested were not as good as mercenary (so CC as well).

    Personnally, I'go for mercenary sleeves / gloves, and remove those martial arts ncus for the sefguarded db ones, to get a bit of hp and evades. And use slippers of screaming as well, the difference in pure DD will be minimal, but you will be able to take some hits without being stomped to death as soon as you pull aggro from a sleeping enfo.

    EDIT : and db bracer as well. You loose a little bit of add damage, but more than make up for it with the added stats. And by the way, for a pure crit setup, there is an alba bracer that gives 1% crit, although it won't give better damage than an arul.
    Last edited by Poufpaf; Jun 21st, 2009 at 23:37:11.

  6. #6
    Regarding DB sleeves vs CM or CC sleeves.

    To the best of my knowledge 30 Points in MA skill with AR >2600 will not effect the damage on a Shen stick much less on a duel Shen stick Ma. If this is correct and I will make a small something clearer

    Fists Ma: 24 Hits/Min (If my memory serves me correctly)
    Fists + 1Weapon: 36 Hits/Min (18 Weapon, 18 Fists)
    Fists + 2Weapons: 40 Hits/Min (13 W1, 13 W2, 14 Fists or something like that)

    Now taking that into consideration:
    If you're a Double Shen stick Ma, the bonus you get from 30 Ma skill means roughly 33% of your hits will be hitting higher (say 30 points? (Only Applys on CRITS not norm damage) +10 Points per hit)


    So out of 100 hits (CC or CM Sleeves) you'd get something like:

    30 Damage*(33%)*100 hits = 990 Damage
    +
    10 *100= 1000 Damage

    Total: 1990 Extra Damage per 100 hits (If your lucky to get all your fist crits)


    VS

    1% crit bonus from DB Sleeve (I won't calc the +agi that can make up for a few points in MA skill)

    The difference in the crit and normal hit from fists are what.. say 4k?
    And the Difference from a Shen stick is what 3k?
    (Depending if you're fighting high AC mobs or not)

    Rounding that up it's about 3.5k. So 3500 Extra damage off of 100 Hits whice is higher the a CC or CM sleeve


    P.S: Please correct me if I'm wrong but this is the knowledge I have been using for a while.
    Last edited by Infinitynova; Jun 22nd, 2009 at 05:14:21.
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  7. #7
    That's the kind of reasoning I used, although the difference on a crit with shen is only 2k, but then I tested it out on those big unicorns near 220 BS, which have the advantage of having always the same level, AC and hp. Well the DD was better with CM sleeves on than with db sleeves, although there doesn't seem to be any logic for this. I agree that the result might be different on SL, but I haven't found the courage to test it out there.

    Anway, remember than CM / CC buff a lot more skills than just MA, it might be also that your brawl is higher for instance. Anyway, none of those are a bad choice I think, just the CM sleeves add a bit more melee skills and hp (and if, like me, you wear very little pieces of AI armor, you will still need a few to avoid wasting a ton of IP in fast attack / parry / riposte / dimach etc).

  8. #8
    I know it's not much of a defensive setup indeed, it's not supposed to be actually, it's really about DDing, nothing else. Although there aren't a lotta dynas (which drop expensive things) that you won't be able to solo with this kinda setup. Look at Hecklers bosses, Creepy and all the rest, it's pretty easy, especially with MoK.
    Angevil, proud 220 MA from Rimor.
    Flourishing anew. About twelve GUI/Perk/Armor setups done so far, hopefully that one will outlast the criticism of my perfectionism!

    Ars Magna. Histories became artifacts, images of poor effect, memories filled with acts and neglect
    As a vulture of cultures I indeed feed my seeds with much greed, soaked in pleasure I succeed

  9. #9
    Well I'd be interested in comparing this one with my own setup, to see how much more damage it really provides. If anyone can put up that setup, we'll set out together to run a DD and test out survivability against level 250 inf dynas.

    And by the way, the infused viral compiler is indeed a defensive choice, so can be replaced by another martial arts ncu. It won't be useful unless you need to cast your nanos under an init defuff (which is why I use it too).
    Last edited by Poufpaf; Jun 22nd, 2009 at 12:07:17.

  10. #10
    Hum, maybe, but there's a limit. xD
    Angevil, proud 220 MA from Rimor.
    Flourishing anew. About twelve GUI/Perk/Armor setups done so far, hopefully that one will outlast the criticism of my perfectionism!

    Ars Magna. Histories became artifacts, images of poor effect, memories filled with acts and neglect
    As a vulture of cultures I indeed feed my seeds with much greed, soaked in pleasure I succeed

  11. #11
    Posted this on the Trader forums not to long ago since someone was asking about +crit items.

    Quote Originally Posted by Whealer View Post
    Head - Predator's Circlet - 1%
    Back - Spirit Shroud of the Artillery - 1%
    Right Shoulder - Superior Icy Shoulderpads of Brawn - 3%
    Chest - Enhanced Dustbrigade Combat Chestpiece - 2%
    Left Shoulder - Imbued Globe of Clarity - 2%
    Right Arm - Enhanced Dustbrigade Sleeves - 1%
    Left Arm - Enhanced Dustbrigade Sleeves - 1%
    Legs - Enhanced Dustbrigade Covering - 1%
    Left Wrist - Modified Ancient Combat Bracer - 1%
    Right Finger - Ring of Gruesome Misery - 1%
    Hud 1 - Alien Combat Directive Controller - 2%
    Hud 2 - Dreadloch Sniper's Friend - 5%
    Hud 3 - Viral Targeting Subunit - 15%
    Util 1 - Stellar Trader Nanodeck - 2%
    Util 2 - Aquarius's Multitask Calculator - 2%
    Util 3 - ObiTom's Nano Calculator - 2%
    Eye Implant - Exterminator Ocular Enhancement - 3%
    Research - Sensitive Negotiations 10 - 5%
    Nano - Divest Skills (Nanite Improved) - 12%
    Nano - Plunder Skills (Nanite Improved) - 12%
    Nano - Mark of Peril - 7%
    Nano - Take the Shot - 4%
    Item - Steaming Hot Cup of Enhanced Coffee - 1%
    Base Crit - 3%

    = +89% Critical Increase

    Interestingly a Martial Artist can only get +77% consistent Critical Increase with an additional +19 coming from a proc bringing the grand total to +96%
    There are going to be a few differences for MAs from what a Trader can get in equipment. First off MAs will loose +2% crit from HUD items and +3% from implants. We also loose +5% from perk lines and another +7% from nanos since we can't run MoP and UVC at the same time.

    We can however make up +1% from using a Dreadloch Stabilising Aid in HUD 1 and moving the Alien Combat Directive Controller to Util 1. We can also use Syndicate Brain Symbiant of the Balanced, +1%, to make up some of the loss from implants. There is also the +3% from the Intuition perk line as well as the +19% from procs.
    Malcom Ciafardoni
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    I'm not a gimp, I'm a trade skill Trader.

  12. #12
    Thank you ALL for the very useful information.

    I have been reading a number of posts and there seems to be some disagreement over the effectiveness of Shens. In PvM are they the best method to generate damage?

  13. #13
    The debate was over the use of shens in pvp. I don't think you'll find someone ready to say that shens don't provide the best overall damage in pvm at the moment. There might be some slight disagreement on whether and when to use one or two of them, some using two at all times, others using only one against aliens or other RK foes, but nothing other than that.

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by __Hellfire__ View Post
    OK, I take back what I said. Running more numbers and accounting for AC, lots of damage buffs, etc., I now have an idea of when Fist alone will OD 2x BoBs.

    First of all, it isn't hard for an Opifex MA to get 2,700 MA self without Moonmist (and cap MA at 3,000 with Umbral and Moonmist).

    If you assume AAO of 284 and add damage of 834, the BoBs will OD 1 fist alone at any AC above 6,000 which is practically nothing except maybe on Aliens. For mobs with 42,000+ AC, a 2x BoB combo will OD the Fist alone by a hefty 14%.

    So like I said, I take back what I said. With the breakeven at 6,000 AC the 2xBoBs are the best for almost every situation if you have alot of add damage buffs.

    Less add damage buffs favor fist alone, full def favors BoBs over slow fist.

    Here are some interesting stats:

    Crit Procs - triple wielding tend to boost the average overall crit rate by only 2.5% and total damage by only 2% in min damage situations. The proc rate is 72.6% for first alone, and 85.6% for triple wielding.

    Disharmony is a big boost for triple wielding, worth 8% more damage over time.

    1% crit = 27 add damage buff = 35 MA skill in triple wield configuration.
    This post taken from the With LE, are BoBs useless? thread is what i base most of my crit vs. +dmg decisions on.

    That thread has about the most extensive research I've seen done on the topic. It's a good read, and would be a nice addition to the rooted ma links thread if it's not there already.
    Last edited by Vlain; Jun 23rd, 2009 at 11:54:55.
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    Vlainstrike 220/30ma[S][Pics]; Jadeprakasha 220/12mp; Crashloop 167/23fx
    --------------------------------------------------
    Concept MA Attack: Attack of the Three Fates
    --------------------------------------------------
    Twas brillig, and the slithy toves
    Did gyre and gimble in the wabe;
    All mimsy were the borogoves,
    And the mome raths outgrabe.
    ~Lewis Carroll

  15. #15
    Has anyone tried using something along the lines of this in their left hand for Fast attack? I thought about Medi last time but that nerfs main AR/AI perks, and Ocrap Viper is too low DD. I imagine the AR on its blows wouldn't be amazing (Like 2.2-2.5k? Totally depending on setup), you would lose like 100-500 damage on regulars-crits from not having MBS but gain an extra attack every 6 seconds? Thats an extra hit every 1.5 attack cycle... I think it could be worth it if the mobs your slapping don't evade it.

    Additionally in things such as inferno missions you can use doors and coming up from behind a mob to land sneak attack without hiding. (Though I and alot of people already seem to do this with their Sapp bow)

    It will probably dent your IP more then you feel like it should and want it to. You'd have to finish IP on Piercing, put a ton into Fastk and gain a heavy dose of melee init. IP eater for sure, but possible. Haven't calc'd much of it just a few basic things.

    I think it will be nice for Pande/Alappa and all that, crappy in things like Dust Brigade questing/instances, no idea about Xan stuff I haven't done this yet so I wouldn't know how often these evade stuff. I imagine it will be crappy (But you won't be wielding a Deceit much before you're finished anyway, maybe whilst you're farming Beta's)

    Don't think i'll ever try it since i'm too much of a TL5 junky... but I was just bored and thinking.
    Last edited by Turbocharged; Jul 1st, 2009 at 08:48:00.
    Last edited by Means; Mar 13th, 2009 at 20:49:27. Reason: What you do with your little finger is your own business and not for this thread.
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  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Turbocharged View Post
    Has anyone tried using something along the lines of this in their left hand for Fast attack? I thought about Medi last time but that nerfs main AR/AI perks, and Ocrap Viper is too low DD. I imagine the AR on its blows wouldn't be amazing (Like 2.2-2.5k? Totally depending on setup), you would lose like 100-500 damage on regulars-crits from not having MBS but gain an extra attack every 6 seconds? Thats an extra hit every 1.5 attack cycle... I think it could be worth it if the mobs your slapping don't evade it.

    Additionally in things such as inferno missions you can use doors and coming up from behind a mob to land sneak attack without hiding. (Though I and alot of people already seem to do this with their Sapp bow)

    It will probably dent your IP more then you feel like it should and want it to. You'd have to finish IP on Piercing, put a ton into Fastk and gain a heavy dose of melee init. IP eater for sure, but possible. Haven't calc'd much of it just a few basic things.

    I think it will be nice for Pande/Alappa and all that, crappy in things like Dust Brigade questing/instances, no idea about Xan stuff I haven't done this yet so I wouldn't know how often these evade stuff. I imagine it will be crappy (But you won't be wielding a Deceit much before you're finished anyway, maybe whilst you're farming Beta's)

    Don't think i'll ever try it since i'm too much of a TL5 junky... but I was just bored and thinking.
    might be fun for goofing around with if you wanted to blow alot of ip in melee init, but you won't even get combined ma attack with it, so you wouldn't gain any additional attacks, and you'd be giving up ma special attacks - shen sticks will blow it away
    o¤°`°¤o,¸¸¸,o¤°¤o,¸¸¸,o¤°`°¤o mahnamahna roflmao mahnamahna o¤°`°¤o,¸¸¸,o¤°¤o,¸¸¸,o¤°`°¤o

    Vlainstrike 220/30ma[S][Pics]; Jadeprakasha 220/12mp; Crashloop 167/23fx
    --------------------------------------------------
    Concept MA Attack: Attack of the Three Fates
    --------------------------------------------------
    Twas brillig, and the slithy toves
    Did gyre and gimble in the wabe;
    All mimsy were the borogoves,
    And the mome raths outgrabe.
    ~Lewis Carroll

  17. #17
    I ment 1 shen stick with 1 Deceit in the offhand. Sorry about that, unless having only 1 weapon with combined MA will block fists. Then it will be useless ofcourse
    Last edited by Means; Mar 13th, 2009 at 20:49:27. Reason: What you do with your little finger is your own business and not for this thread.
    The Atrox has won.

    Lockpicking successful.
    You gained 1 points of Shadowknowledge.
    Welcome to Shadowlevel 220.

  18. #18
    Sorry to revive pretty old thread but what are the current changes to 220 MA max damage setup and what kind of DPM is achievable? Any viable options in upgraded beast armor to use instead of dchest/Enhanced Dustbrigade Combat Chestpiece (btw. which one is better in sl/RK?)

  19. #19
    new things would be beast shoulderpad in terms of crit and also awakened combat board.

    This adds another 5% crit to what was achievable before.

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