Practical Nemesises

[-Klod-]

Yes. That's the main effect of off/def focus.. it prevents using NS2 with LE nukes. It last 30 minutes and is refreshed on cast.

SoZ/bow MPs are nowhere close in difference between off/def NTs.

NTs are equally viable in both stances, MPs aren't, hence the need to make distinction between these two.

[Molotoff]

NTs are equally viable in both stances,

Wrong.

[Persku]

Docs - Enforcers, rage clears DoTs (stupid), ignores init debuffs, alpha based profession with several possible stuns, all perks land.

Docs - Shades, highest alpha damage against NON-EVADE PROFESSIONS, best choice for defeating a doctor (now that traders are nerfed).

enf alpha is more damgerous to doc than shades. shade stuns are luck but enf can chain stun always.

shade alpha isnt problem to doc, nanodrains are when duel.

[Livesangry]

Added some, looking for more!

[-Klod-]

Wrong.

OK, to be more precise, more equal then bow MP/SoZ options.

[Esssch]

Why make a distinction between bow/zset MPs, and not off/def focus NT ?

Because switching between bow/zset is more than just casting a nano then waiting 30 mins then casting another nano?

[Ocene]

Eh, not to validate this fairly pointless thread in any way,

This thread is actually a really good idea.

It's good to see what people perceptions are.

[Gatester]

enf alpha is more damgerous to doc than shades. shade stuns are luck but enf can chain stun always.

shade alpha isnt problem to doc, nanodrains are when duel.

Depends on the shade and enforcer. An enforcer can, and is more likely to have only their 1hb stun perk putting them similar to enforcers. Enforcers have brawl stun, shades will either have the proc stun or nano drain (BS/mass pvp or duels).

The enforcer alpha is fairly consistent damage, and if you do not include dimach (duels) then your shades will have significantly more alpha damage than an enforcer. Generally, your gank atrox shades will have a lower damage alpha and setup than your average shade. The one in my sig for instance is a PVM oriented setup that is actually very dangerous for doctors due to the shere DPM I can produce.

[Strupstad]

Fixer - NT's have a practical nemesis on fixer's due to there nukes, which are not resistable. making fixers toolset useless.

isn't this the story for every profession? CB, double, double, dead.

[mr_road]

Generally, your gank atrox shades will have a lower damage alpha and setup than your average shade.

cos only atroxes perk SR 6 instead of TR ?

replace "gank atrox shades" with "pvp orientated shades" and replace "average" with "pvm".

an all out dd shade (with shade touch perked) will have an even easier time with doc's due to the extra init debuffs and dd perks that come with it.

[Molotoff]

OK, to be more precise, more equal then bow MP/SoZ options.

Agreed, but off/def focus NTs have different advantages / disadvantages. And if you don't separate them, you can be sure that people will only look at the best of both worlds, which will result in a wrong perception (which certainly does not bother NT haters). It may not matter for duels where peoples can and are ready to wait 30 minutes to clear whatever focus was running (and have NBS ready), but in any other PvP environment (like BS), the NT will not be able to have the best focus for each fight.

Because switching between bow/zset is more than just casting a nano then waiting 30 mins then casting another nano?

It's irrelevant.

Besides, right clicking an item and waiting a few seconds is much faster than waiting 30 minutes with a reduced toolset. Granted, you need an appropriate setup, but you have the possibility to do it. When there were still MPs in BS, you could see some of them do it.

[Neosh1]

Trader
doc - cast nanoskill drain, cast nano drain, win

[Moonbolt]

Trader
doc - cast nanoskill drain, cast nano drain, win

errr lol... maybe u should work on ur doc a bit if a trader wins over u.

[-Klod-]

Besides, right clicking an item and waiting a few seconds is much faster than waiting 30 minutes with a reduced toolset. Granted, you need an appropriate setup, but you have the possibility to do it. When there were still MPs in BS, you could see some of them do it.

It's not only about right clicking the items (by that, you mean Tigress/SoZ "hot" swap?).

Those two setups bring totally different perk setups and armor choice, not to mention significantly different symbiant/implant choices, which is most certainly not "swappable" in 30 minutes.

[Persku]

errr lol... maybe u should work on ur doc a bit if a trader wins over u.

traders are hard on doc, they can keep our nanos all time 0-2k and 2 drain procs all time -330 skills so cant malp or dot much so only damage is AS and they outheal it

[Hvyshadows]

It really depends on the level. At lower levels, traders are much harder on docs than at 220. They rarely land drains on me, and when they do I can clear them pretty much immediately. So, the only issues they bring up are the drain procs and GTH (::shudder:. In mass PvP, having a trader on me is a pain. In one-on-one PvP, the average trader doesn't present a problem. -330 to skils doesn't even come close to stopping me cast Malp, DoTs, etc. and usually doesn't make them land all that less frequently. GTH is still and issue, though. Mainly just because it makes spamming Malp much tougher.

[mjuler]

Trader
doc - cast nanoskill drain, cast nano drain, win

What he said.

[Perskules]

It really depends on the level. At lower levels, traders are much harder on docs than at 220. They rarely land drains on me, and when they do I can clear them pretty much immediately. So, the only issues they bring up are the drain procs and GTH (::shudder:. In mass PvP, having a trader on me is a pain. In one-on-one PvP, the average trader doesn't present a problem. -330 to skils doesn't even come close to stopping me cast Malp, DoTs, etc. and usually doesn't make them land all that less frequently. GTH is still and issue, though. Mainly just because it makes spamming Malp much tougher.

dont have nano to malp spam. and lots countters because of drain procs, with accumulator+rk nanodrains+ring can keep nanopool almost empty when gth is on cooldown. biggest problem is getting damage on them without malp+dots.

[Esssch]

It's irrelevant.

Besides, right clicking an item and waiting a few seconds is much faster than waiting 30 minutes with a reduced toolset. Granted, you need an appropriate setup, but you have the possibility to do it. When there were still MPs in BS, you could see some of them do it.

You really have no idea what you're talking about, do you?

There are MPs that can switch between SoZ and Tigress at will. Those MPs are wearing CSS. So yes, let's compare a couple of rare MPs that have spent over 1b on their setup to every single NT that's spent 3 days levelling and is 210+

[Gatester]

cos only atroxes perk SR 6 instead of TR ?

replace "gank atrox shades" with "pvp orientated shades" and replace "average" with "pvm".

an all out dd shade (with shade touch perked) will have an even easier time with doc's due to the extra init debuffs and dd perks that come with it.

I figured he was referring to those atroxes running around all over the place, but you are correct