About the new Aimed Shot

[XenonDe]

Point 5 is not un-important either...

Yeah true. Any fixer can vouch for that. xD

[Waahash]

SA:
1.) Weapon damage is multiplied by AR multiplier
2.) The damage range is adjusted for ACs lowering the max damage
3.) A random roll between min and max Damage is used.
4.) Crit Modifier adjusted by AR is added onto the damage if it was a critical
5.) The SA multiplier is applied. (before multiplier, remember someone having tested this. confirmation?)
5.) Damage Gear is added to the final damage.

AS:
1.) Weapon damage is multiplied by AR multiplier
2.) The damage range is not adjusted by ACs as it ignores AC
3.) The maximum Damage is used instead of rolling.
4.) Crit Modifier adjusted by AR is added onto the damage if it was a critical
5.) Damage Gear is added onto the resulting damage before AS Muliplier
6.) The AS multiplier is applied.

By not ignoring ACs and using a random roll between min and max damage instead of using max damage there is much more room for variation on the damage for SA then for AS.

;o

Been looking for something like this for a while. Mayhaps you have information on backstab as well?

[XenonDe]

I actually had a small error in 5.) it was meant to be "before damage modifier" not "before multiplier" to make any sense.

I believe backstab follows the same rules as SA but it requires higher SA skill to increase the multiplier for backstab. Same as with SA and AS you also need a certain amount of SA skill to unlock special like the abillity to crit but that is reached at fairly low levels as well.

Also I'm trying to find confirmation for the ACs being applied before the SA muliplier. I am fairly sure the AC are applied before the multiplier but it's better to have confirmation on that. For 5.) on SA it should be fairly easy to test with shades and noting the difference between average SA/Backstabs with TR running and without TR running but my shade regulary hits 11-13k already so I can't test it very well.

[Waahash]

I actually had a small error in 5.) it was meant to be "before damage modifier" not "before multiplier" to make any sense.

I believe backstab follows the same rules as SA but it requires higher SA skill to increase the multiplier for backstab. Same as with SA and AS you also need a certain amount of SA skill to unlock special like the abillity to crit but that is reached at fairly low levels as well.

Happen to know the defensive check/offensive checks on backstab? I've gotten it to land on endgame crats and at other times it's missed on enforcers and NTs. It lands more often than not but it's puzzling sometimes to perk someone but still not land backstab through a stun ;p

[XenonDe]

Afraid I don't. Seeing as it nearly never misses in pvm and quite often on high evade profs it may work like a regular attack but only counting in AAD instead of evades+aad. It used to sometimes miss on the base 3% hit/miss chance but the got rid of these base chances some patches ago. It's really only a guess though.

Also I'm feeling confident about AC being applied before the SA multiplier now as I remembered the SA on my shade being integer multiplier of my regular hit all the time before it reached up to 10k. If my regular was 1500 the SA always was either a 4500, 6000 or 7500 hit.
Do note though that backstab damage gets nerfed after going over 10k damage. Any additional damage after 10k is nerfed by 50% up to 11500 damage. After that any additional damage is nerfed by 75%. That is why it is so hard to get pure 13k damage backstabs.

€: Also this would prove that I am mistaken about the Add Damage being applied AFTER the SA multiplier and it is instead applied BEFORE the multiplier, at least at the backstab mechanics.

[Waahash]

That is why it is so hard to get pure 13k damage backstabs.

I get 13k backstabs all the time ;o

[XenonDe]

By now yes. Since TL7 it's the same for my shade. The reason is the SA skill being so high that we get big multipliers. Think back to TL 5/6. You often saw 10 or 11k backstabs but the pure 13k one was rare. Also above the 10k you saw backstabs that aren't a integer multiplier of your regular damage.

[Radia]

I wonder: would these concerns go away if the weaker, secondary version of AS (which is supposed to be instant, and I assume also sharing a cooldown with AS / FA / SA itself) were opened up to other professions?

This would also work around the issue of rooting professions struggling to land roots against immune professions (lets face it - advies); as you could kite and use the weaker AS.

[Sinfullie]

Why is it when FC tries to go and BALENCE the game, a bunch of people come out of the woodwork to cry about a nerf to something that has been clearly broken for a long time.

Think of it this way, the special has been known to be overpowered for so long that even pre LE/pre Xan, you had a LOT of 220's wearing onehanders. When an antiquated weapon that the only reason to have it is to gain aimed shot on a profession that (generally) shouldn't be using it in the first place, theres obviously a problem. It's saying that all this developer time put into trying to develop unique solid solutions to balence is going to basically fall into the same problem, they are trying to stop every possible ranged toon from being AS/Burst/Fling.

All these people that are complaining about the AS nerf are the same people complaining about that it's hard to be unique. PICK A SIDE OF THE FENCE TO BE ON!

Whats unique about dualwielding a SMG or a AMEP with a onehander? Nothing, your just another cookie cutter.

[Ciex]

Id like to see how for example a soldier is supposed to ever kill a fixer without AS.

From what i remember aimedshot was never overpowered after dark ages of outside crit buffs, except for agents that could cap dmg on most of people due to their high AS skill plus high crit chance and good weapons. I remember ranged adventurers with onehander plus whatever – they were gimps. Crats with pistol plus onehander were so gimp that some of them started using bows or some other silly items. For docs craphander setup was so bad that they were using ithacas etc. etc. And suddenly AS pistol arrived followed by low def check pistol mastery perks. It was told to be a temporary (2 years ago?) solution of some problems (im still not sure if there were any problems at all). Do you remember those calculations showing that AS pistol is no better than onehander? And those proofs that it will never cap ? I remember it as good as if it was yesterday. Those adventurers telling us to calm down because there is nothing wrong with it …

What im trying to tell is that there may be no AS problem at all, just remove as pistol and lets see how it works. I see no reason behind AS locking FA and vice versa. If it was thought to nerf hotswapping alphas why couldn’t we disable firing specials during swapping time? Or disable sapping when special timer is running? There are may interesting builds with FA and AS weapons at lower levels and those are the only ones somehow viable in pvp. I mean fixers and ranged advys here, some solds. Why would we change something that works ok?

Maybe its mechanic should just work like SA with AC check, lower multipliers etc.?

[Graftmage]

OMG It check ACs, that's really relevant in PVP

Of course it matters. Aimed shot is based of max weapon damage, sneak attack is based on max-min damage roll that includes ACs, making it way worse that AS.

Aimed shot should obviously be nerfed, just because it's being used by EVERYONE even those who are not really supposed to be using it.

@3 second interruptible cast: welcome to the NT world

[Ocene]

If AAD didn't become what it is, then maybe those that "aren't supposed to use Aimed Shot" would use their toolsets instead.

[viandante]

What toolset?

[Vickie]

MP NSD off course oh and Curse of Cronos...

[-Klod-]

You forgot dominates. Those insta-kill soldiers.

[Ocene]

You forgot dominates. Those insta-kill soldiers.

If you guys look carefully at Klod's avatar, you will notice that his forehead has a small hole, right in the middle of it.........

......that's my bullet.

[XenonDe]

wow. 1 Bullet FAs suck eh?

[Gunfytr]

wow. 1 Bullet FAs suck eh?

AS hotswap.

[Ocene]

AS hotswap.

In the pure art of hotswapping ^^.

[XenonDe]

Nice.

This isn't a troll. honest! err
I don't really know what to write about the new AS. I'm excited and wonder where when it'll turn sour.