Scale AXP daily "challenge" with AI level

[Junttius]

Effort? What effort?

You mean farming/buying drops from content that is barely a challenge?

Getting familiar with different buffs and ways to increase different skills. Just to equip stuff. Theres so much stuff to know right from the beginning. That is a stop for lots of new players. Hopefully the new starting experience shows the stuff better for newcomers

Yep, and AO's population shows you exactly what people really want.

Don't care to start arguing why people play or don't play this game, but I bet quite a big reason also for many are the dated graphics.

[lainbr]

Dailies were suposed to be casual. Dark orange aliens nuking you 4k for every 5s and ignoring your NR completly is not casual.

And I think that there are a bug on Scouts. Some hits you around 500 while others can hit almost 3k at the exactly same lvl.

[Siyra]

Don't care to start arguing why people play or don't play this game, but I bet quite a big reason also for many are the dated graphics.

From what I've seen it's constantly the same people complaining about the graphics. I don't really hear many people talk about it in game, granted I do tend to avoid the drivel oft seen in OOC chats but then the fact that it often is drivel (ie. "you suck", "no you do") kinda says they're not talking about the dated graphics.

I think, for the most part; beyond those people here on the forums who constantly complain about the graphics, a large number of people would be fine with the graphics as if a lot more bugs were ironed out instead. Most people quit because of a cumulative thing, "this stupid move by FC", "this annoying bug that while not the end of the world still annoys", plus "this boring content" tends to add up over time and equates to people leaving. Yes I'm sure there's a "these graphics suck" argument in there too but I doubt that anyone is quitting specifically and only because of the graphics.

Based on that idea I think that there can be a lot done to the game towards player retention while we wait for the new engine along the lines of:

A) Funcom needs to stop being stupid. This means, in relation to this thread in particular, not doing stupid crap because of whining. Blocking people out of content unless they're twinked is stupid, especially when it was totted as accessible to everyone.

B) They need to really stick their nose far down into that bug list and fix some of them. Granted some can't be fixed, or some can wait till the new engine; but some could at least use a thick bandaid. See: this thread

C) The community needs to stop being so belligerent and hostile; continually berating people because they have an issue with something that you don't (like this entire AI daily difficulty debate, in more then just this thread) only leads to people not wanting anything to do with the game. See my sigi for a good quote from Taz on that subject.

That's just a few things off the top of my head that would make the game a lot more enjoyable for me, dated graphics or not. Just because a game like WoW or EU or whichever has good graphics if the community/company sucks and there's a lot of bugs I won't play it.

Like WoW, main reason I won't play it? Because Blizzard is a bunch of *******s with their "region lock" bull**** that basically negates the entire point behind the internet by limiting you to only being able to play an "MMO" with people in your region. They did the same BS to SC2. Why should I waste money on a game, even bug free with amazing graphics, if I can't even play it the way I want with the people I want?

Anyway, way off topic rant I blame lack of sleep.

Bottom line is, Funcom needs to fix this; if they want to give a challenge to people that's great, fine; do it. I'd welcome it. But do it as an option, rather then just change things so that everything's a challenge because that just leaves people out (unable to do content), ticks em off (one step more towards quitting), and creates tension among the community as we each pick sides of the argument to be on.

[Warhead]

From what I've seen it's constantly the same people complaining about the graphics. I don't really hear many people talk about it in game, granted I do tend to avoid the drivel oft seen in OOC chats but then the fact that it often is drivel (ie. "you suck", "no you do") kinda says they're not talking about the dated graphics.

This isnt about graphics here, but I'll point your error out for you: new people see the comparatively craptastic graphics that makes their wonderful high-end machine seem like something from the year 2002.

That is what they mean. We're not talking about the people who play this game already. Its about those who are supposed to start playing it. No matter what number of (to them unknown) bugs you remove, they wont stay long enough to give a damn. People today want three things:

1. Eye candy
2. An almost flat learning curve
3. Fast and easy success

AO cant deliver on the second two, but Funcom needs to make sure the first impression (visuals) is good enough for them to not run for the exit after 5 minutes.

Back to topic, which is part of the other two points I listed above.

[Junttius]

Really good points from both of you warhead and siyra. My weekend started today so i'm unable to join the discussion effectively, since i'm drinking beer and working on my fixer. But I will be reading!

[Hvyshadows]

...so i guess we will continue doing team city raid dailies for leveling people, since they cant really complete single missions now.

This is not necessarily a bad thing....

[GCBacon]

Wasn't hard at all on lvling gimp TL5 enf. TL7s had no problem, even gimp agent(self buffed) UBTed most in 1-2 tries. Only Ensign seemed to resist UBT more. Maybe aliens get more powerful @certain break points and that's where ppl get in trouble? Ask for RRFE/GSF/PHN/etc before venturing into dailies if you find them hard. IMO the risk is good for reward.

[Gatess]

The problem with these mishs isn't exactly the difficulty but the scaling. If you enter a mish with high hp bar aliens with big damage leave, wait a min and re-enter and tadaa.. you have a new mish with gimpzor aliens that (at lower levels) die in 2 hits.

For some reason the scaling of +/- 10 levels or what it is supposed to be doesn't work quite well. As example my 200 MA usually rushes through these mishs no problem but every few mishs even the entrance mobs give her a struggle with 2.5 regulars and nukes and having twice over the HP as the gimp versions.

Balancing them with that huge a difference in the gimp and OP scaling versions is gonna be difficult and from what I heard it's not intended that some mishs use a different scaling. Fix that and these threads will disapear.

I don't why i was moderated so I will do it again.

I want to subscribe to XenonDe's idea. I think he might be on to something.

The devs should look this way, imo.

Why was any of the above subject of moderation.. idk ;P

[nitr0]

the point is the following:

my 220 ma for example could do any ai daily without the need to heal or anything before they made them harder.

now after they are harder: my ma can still do them without the need of healing himself at all.

so what's the deal u might ask?

simple... my 200 crat (with above average equip for sure, he's xp locked and equipped for sec7) had a hard time with dailies before and now it's even worse...

so, while changing not much for the people who whined on forums (5% of ao population), fc destroyed the mishs for the majority of normal leveling toons, especially beginners...

and that's also why i think "balancing" will kill the game, they listen to those 5% that keep on whining about "how easy everything is for them" and that they can solo everything.

[Autohead]

A whole page of posts vanished lame.

Yeah they do a nice job at hiding the sad truth.

[nitr0]

last statement:

making everything harder != more fun for everybody

making everything harder = those who got everything and can do stuff now easily can still do it and the rest, who still needs stuff, is screwed.

[ZenWon]

I love how geared out and completely jaded people get on here and state how easy the new missions(and everything else) is. And slam the people that are having problems on their leveling and WORKING AS INTENDED toons. Do you really wonder why this game is drying up? Why they constantly have to send out free months to people to try and lure them back so it doesnt look like a ghost town in cities?

YOU. Thats right its YOU. YOU are part of the problem along with things like this patch. Because we all know we needed more challenging aliens RIGHT? Because we dont have enough issues in this game to deal with. When theres nothing left of AO but a few idiots hanging out on the hill(or a reasonable Omni facimile) braggin about how theyve got all the xan alphas in and can one hit Tara, and make the beast their lapdog..then you'll be happy right? Remove all those pathtic gimpy pre-geared 220 noobs, Thats your answer riiiight?

Pathetic. But thats just my opinion. And im nobody. Good day.

[Cyberleet]

Silly move. We do this to level and improve our toons. These mobs don't offer bots or anything.

The aliens doesn't offer new content/combat either, it was the AI-daily mission layout that were exiting.

Back to steep learning-process again and less casual gamer friendly game.

This is not necessarily a bad thing....

Nah, just have AI team and AI solo be on diferent timers. Or Elite AI-team quest for the sectors etc

[Cyberleet]

And the genius daily's that got so much positive feedback, why FC, why?

even gimp agent(self buffed) UBTed most in 1-2 tries.

How did it go without using the mimic doctor buff?

[Hvyshadows]

Personally my opposition to the ease of daily missions (AI or regular) has nothing to do with the whole l2p mentality that is being evicerated here. My issue is that people will generally find and take the path of least resistance to any goal. So, we're having a whole new mentality that has been introduced with daily missions where you log in, do your dailies, and then log off or dink around for a little while first and then log off. That's destructive to the game.

So, I appreciate them making the missions more difficult if only because it will hopefully drive some people back to teams to level or to get the gear that will help them survive in these missions. The reward that is given vs the effort that is put into daily missions at the moment is laughable. I can accomplish the work of 2.5 hours of Inferno missions in less than 20 minutes. And the work of days and days of farming Arid, LE missions, and City raids in less than 20.

Having said all of that, I did run the new AI missions yesterday and they are considerably harder than before. I can understand the frustration and some sort of moderation to the new alien levels/strength is warranted.

[Obtena]

While I can appreciate the difficulty that some people find themselves in when doing these missions, the last thing FC should do is just make unchallenging encounters, essentially handing out 'free' accomplishments. It's apparent that some level of performance should be necessary to complete these solo missions. For some profs, that's been achieved. I think access to these 'easy' ways to get XP/AXP should be slightly harder than regular leveling methods as an incentive to keep up with your equipment and skills.

[drops]

So, I appreciate them making the missions more difficult if only because it will hopefully drive some people back to teams to level or to get the gear that will help them survive in these missions.

Drive them where? Back to Arid? Killing 200 or whatever aliens in a farm team is not more challenging than doing a dailie. Just more time consuming.
And what about the lowbies? They should find teams to do what? LE mishes?

[Tazalanche]

From reading each of the threads on this subject, "challenging" would be fine, "repeatedly killed within less than 10 seconds" is the problem most are experiencing.

Bring back the old version as "easy" or "medium" & make this version "hard". It is not like the mobs are dropping phatz. Heck, take 25% of the AIxp of the easy/medium version & people can make their own choice.

[Hvyshadows]

Drive them where? Back to Arid? Killing 200 or whatever aliens in a farm team is not more challenging than doing a dailie. Just more time consuming.

Again, my comment has nothing to do with making things "more challenging" or with "l2p your toon you effing ghimp". It has everything to do with the fact that easier daily missions = more solo play = death to any MMO. Yes, drive them to an Arid farm team. At least then they might (and I stress the word might) have to actually interact with other players in the game. It's boring sure, but it's boring with a group.

[Marijke]

It was basically free AXP before this patch and imho it's still free AXP now. And yes, I've done AI dailys on levelling chars... pretty poorly equipped levelling chars even.

It can't only be equip that makes these mishes too easy for some ppl and too hard for others. Maybe it's (lack of) knowledge of the game mechanics?