Agreed to that. our org team farmed some relays (28 pieces), which took around 3 hrs. Then we poped 28 generals (killing each one took from 50 seconds to 90 seconds), one by one. Drop was awesome, around 2 bils of credits (or more, afaik).Originally Posted by Notcrattey
I like PvP
TL6: Tereshkova 200 eng / Patrollerz 200 sol / Tankietka 200 NM enf / Pielegniarka 200 Tank Doc / Oleska 200 SOLIKeep
TL5: Miazga 150 sol / Piknababa 150 NM Enf 2he / Gigantika 150 NM Enf / Malutki 150 Enf Trox WIP
TL4: Ladyrazor 112 fixer (retired) / Shha 100 NT / Cycolina lvl 100 NM Enforcer
+ Tons of other chars...
I make weird TwInkz!
Signature updated: 29/06/2016
Once you get into TL 5 & 6 initial toons start to really show cracks. Getting 210+ symbiants, decent armor, good weapon options, SL nanos, HUD items, etc., becomes more difficult and requires financial support and game knowledge. Some players have that, some don't. For those players and their toons who don't have support, taking a break at mid-game where you can regroup, reequip and get ready for the next chunk is incredibly helpful. Whether S10 is the best choice or best solution is clearly a matter of opinion but the underlying need is still there. S10 is accessible to inexperienced players in a way that other money making ventures really aren't.
While the majority of toons making it past TL 4 in this game are likely alts I wouldn't just assume that everyone has a higher toon that is available to make large amounts of money for them. The players I saw who use S10 to pay for their equipment are often the same players who had appallingly poorly set up TL 6/7s that had a tremendously tough time killing anything.
^^ well said.
hopefully what was said by Means in the last Q&A, about one-time quests that give credits and gear being added, sees the light of day. alternatively, dailies giving random gear rewards based on character level would be better, but as always, that makes too much sense to be implemented into AO. would be cool to have "blue" armour & gear in ao from dailies, but thats a pipe dream from a player standpoint.
Last edited by SoapTarder; Dec 21st, 2011 at 21:52:11.
wtf happened to my avatars eyebrows?
I used to listen to Dubstep in the 90's... every time I connected to the internet.
As others have said, who's to say I had better toons for the job at higher levels? Of course later I did ya, I went from an adv in T1 to an MA in CM/CC/Ofab (and my adv went to CM and SoS/SoC). And guess where the cash came from? Not from farming alb or zods on some twinked out TL7 dual logged or with friends - it came from pearls and S10 and being lucky enough to get some loot that was worth selling to more then a wood chipper.
This assumption that we all just sprouted on newb island with a TL7 main is asinine - and gearing the game as if there is no need for support in the lower/mid level ranges is equally so.
Oh I don't know.. perhaps the ability to actually gear a toon with gear that would allow them to be competitive. That to me seems helpful.
If I chose to level my MA she'd do a lot better to not be a useless mooch in Inf mishs with the gear she has now - as opposed to the crap she'd have if it wasn't for S10.
Shhh... I'm in disguise.
Your post makes sense of the s10 nerf, it was never intended to be a place for people to farm non stop to make credits, all of those 4m bounties were new credits introduced into the economy. Over time to many new credits were created which then caused inflation and everything became over priced. If you want gear do it like normal people do city raids, farm nanos to sell (froobs seem to make tons of money from this). You can still do bosses in s10 to get bots and items to sell or use which is what s10 was intended for.
Oh so you're an expert in what things were supposed to be?
Perhaps when it was released they did intend it to be a way to get some money - simply because they've now nerfed it after all the trolls whined doesn't mean that they didn't originally think it was a good idea to let people make money there.
The credits that S10 created were nothing compared to other means, the more unsavory kind, and I for one saw nothing similar to the "game destroying inflation" others claimed was the fault of S10.
Shhh... I'm in disguise.
Then now make normal toons 150 really meant for pvp, theres towers at that lvl too so theres no reason to not make em. S10 can still be done, and itll still get you something, just need to put in more effort now
Can you not make money there now or something?
Sounds like a really good way to make creds. Perhaps even the best IG.
But not completely outrageously good like it used to be.
No offense to all you trolls defending s10 nerf. The only thing that matters is facts.
1. The fact is the nerf didnt help anyone and in fact caused more people to leave ao.
2. Who the hell gives a dam about Combined armour. You would seriously nerf an area over a bunch of rich people complaining that other people can afford things now.
3. Its not the new people farming s10 that made the price of combined go up, its the same people who say nerf s10 that raised the price of combined.
It dosent matter what people think. The only thing that matter is that it DIDNT help the game!
S10 is dead and mostly all BS is dead.
The thing that I personally think is most wrong with the change to S10 isn't that bounties/ice were removed as much as they were removed without the changes (mentioned by Means in one of his FwM posts) being implemented at the same time.
Maybe I'm jaded or maybe I've truly lost touch with newbies but... from a video gamer point of view it simply doesn't make sense to me that 25% through your leveling experience you simply stop and farm a single area with the hopes of raising creds to fund your TL7/220 toons (existing or in the future). I've played a lot of MMO's and I've never seen that approach used.
In layman's terms, it is borderline retarded that so many players felt that rolling and farming on a level 150 toon was the most effecient way to fund their pre-existing TL6/7 mains. I'm not calling the players retarded.. but a game set up that way is fundamentally flawed. It is the flaw that many players complained about and (to be repetitive) funcom fixed the work around for the flaw (the flaw being reasonable ways to obtain average gear and credits in conjunction with the standard leveling/questing process) but didn't do anything to actually correct the flaw itself.
So all of the people pissed off about the bounty removal should be spending their time/effort asking Funcom how they plan to fix the flax and when (if you even believe any deadlines they ever communicate) instead of wasting time hurling insults at other players that recognize the same issue that they do.
Igoc price before S10: 950 m, current price: 600 m.
300 css before: 900 m, after: 600 m.
Some say the bounties and the billions they added to the game had nothing to do with the price hike. While i personally dont believe the accumulation of creds from s10 bounties were the sole reason i am certain it played a major role. The sudden pricedrop after the nerf certainly seems to indicate this may be true.
Ps. I am still waiting for someone to explain why one 150 toon should be able to outfarm my army of 220's by a factor of 2:1.
Last edited by Noobius76; Dec 24th, 2011 at 15:17:21.
I still stand by my belief that the amount of creds coming out of S10 (seeded creds; from bounties) on a monthly basis still did not reach, or barely reached the amount of credits removed by cities and instanced cities. would love to be proven wrong on that one, but do the math if you're willing, and you will come to the same conclusion maybe. recent price drops are just due to who has the creds, not how many creds are floating around in total. half a dozen in one, 6 in the other etc..
wtf happened to my avatars eyebrows?
I used to listen to Dubstep in the 90's... every time I connected to the internet.
What you have just described is not a need for a massive credit farm junction in the midst of player leveling, ie level 150. What you described is the flaw within AO's leveling design where players have unnecessary difficulties acquiring needed gear and items as they progress through the game.
Rather than try to ignore the problem by infusing a massive credit farm into the game so that players can think they will then be able to purchase everything they ever need, would it not be better to simply fix the problem and make level progression a more streamlined and sensible task? With s7 weapons and ofab however, I hardly see as many gearing problems as people keep trying to claim we have.
Your misunderstanding of what I said seems to have lead you to make many asinine assumptions of your own. In no way did I say 220 or Tl7 main, I said higher level toon. If you are not lazy there are indeed several options for players who are willing to put forth the effort to actually raise credits to fund their characters.
Do you think before s10 existed all players were instantly wealthy and could afford whatever they wanted? Before some off-the-wall comment about players who gained massive amounts of credits through unintended or illegitimate means, I would ask you to actually think about just what percent of the population actually took advantage of these opportunities before S10. Even 1% of the population would be an extreme figure and 1000's of billions of credits are probably gone now with terminated or banned accounts.
Can you not farm implants? Can you not blitz nanos? Can you not offer tradeskill and buff services? Can you not farm pocket bosses and sell symbiants? Can you not sell lootrights to nodrop items? Can you not farm city raids?
Asside from lootrights in most cases NONE of those tasks require a TL7 or 220 main. I had to earn my first 100mil from blitzing nanos and I have made well over 1 billion in symbiants with much less effort than many think. The nanos I farmed as a froob 126 advy using clicksaver. Those symbiants were from scheol and adonis and can be farmed with a tl5 or tl6.
The fact is, s10 bounties were not a needed way for players to acquire credits, it was simply a lazy way that many players participated in and now that it is gone players seem to be too lazy to do what we had to do before s10.
Again, this is a problem with the game design itself. As I have pointed out, there are also a large number of things you could have done to improve your characters, such as actually farming everything you bought instead. Acting as though an MA or any character is useless without 1 billion+ in gear and symbs is also a ridiculous argument. Ofab is easy to acquire and is cheaper to buy from others than the Tier 1 you were making, and I believe s7 has some exceptional weapons even a completely stripped toon could equip. Implants for the weapon skill you need and your adonis quest brain symb are more than enough to get you through for a long time.
There seems to be a consistent exaggeration on the impact of a very small percentage of the gaming population having massive amounts of credits as opposed to what S10 did, causing a very large percentage of the population to have large amounts of credits.
When 1 player has 10 billion credits and another 99 players have maybe 10 million credits, that one player simply buys what he wants when he wants, while the other players are still restricted by the limited credits they all have. Those 99 players could not put 20 million price tags on everything because no one could afford it except one player.
When you have 50 players who are wealthy out of 5000, the same general rule is going to apply. Even if some players are wealthy, those players will not be constantly buying everything the other players have thus forcing prices to remain affordable to the bulk of players except on truly rare items that the wealthy desire.
Now, when you have 50 players with 10 billion+ credits, 950 players with 500 million credits, and 4000 players with 10 million credits, what do you think happens? The prices a large percentage of the playerbase can afford has increased so prices increase. Demand remains high because so many players are needing and buying gear rather than farming it.
The problem caused by one player with a massive amount of credits buying everything on GMS is a shortage in supply. Shortages happen all the time, especially with a new flavor of the month build. If a shortage happens and most players have relatively low amounts of credits then prices will be forced back into a lower level once they stop selling. When everyone has large amounts of credits and can afford the items, then prices do not go down but continually go up.
Before s10 bounties were being farmed you could make a ql225 combined scouts set for 700mil. After the bots were bought up and farmers replenished the supply, suddenly a 225 combined scouts set increased to about 1.5 billion to make the set. Symbiants for level 103-150 players skyrocketed by up to 10x for certain slots. Those are facts.
What good is it to infuse the game economy with credits if it only causes everything to be more expensive? You do not help new players by forcing them to stop and farm for a month just to level.
Last edited by Gatester; Dec 24th, 2011 at 16:51:25.
Sure, and I've commented in other places regarding that. I wasn't addressing whether S10 bounties should be back, just why some people were using it since it looked like you were implying that there wasn't anyone using S10 for a "good" reason or that people were using it when they have better alternatives elsewhere. *shrug*
I think the underlying problems are the differences in gear standards between newer and older players (I always want to throttle people who insist they have to have AI armor) and the lack of knowledge provided for new players. And I love the idea of FC "simply fixing" anything in AO. There's such ripple effects for everything at this point.
AO has a lot more to offer than S10.
If you want to stick to APF, try Sector 42.
Hint, bring (lots of) friends.
I went offline in 2005 and what do I see first when returning? A bunch of whining high-level players in gear I couldn't even imagine back in '05.
Why on earth do you need CM/CC/Ofab to do inf mishes? You know that MAs are not exactly meant to be the team's tank and the meaning of the word team is not "3-highlevel players with their toons on follow"?
You seriously whining about not getting enough money? It took us like forever only to get a stupid yali! Geesh.
The prices only got so high because it was possible to get that money so easily in the first place.
Please funcom, take the square root of all amounts of money and start over.
Last edited by Farmer; Dec 28th, 2011 at 13:24:07. Reason: rant
dear omlets.... DO YOUR DAILY PVP! grmbl.
Anybody remember the ingot nerf? Pretty much the same discussion...
I had a toon in range when S10 was released so I checked it out:
I remember thinking that the axp was not good enough but credit and loot rewards were too good.
Sure enough, after a couple of months, the playfield became a farmers-only playground.
You would almost never see anybody on LFT for S10, and you would not find a team if you tried it that way.
It became an affair for solo twinks and small org-only teams to make fast credits.
In other words, unless you already had an expensive S10 twink, you wouldn't be able to farm S10 to get one - catch 22.
After those initial months, none of my toons have gone to S10 since, even those that were equipped for it.
In my orgs however, people would form these mini-twink teams whenever they were low on cash.
Then they spent a few of hours farming S10 and came back with a few 100Ms in loot and credits to be spent on the toons they were actually leveling.
Bottomline: S10 was detrimental to both team play and to the game economy.
P.S. I made (and still make) most of my credits with a level 60 neutral trader - no farming involved, none whatseover.
Something like this.
with my first character all I was told how to get credits was "farm S10".
so, I finally got to 150 and set my research to run.... and it wasn't worth it.
I mean, sure, I could of farmed items and stuff, but honestly I got more credits from just doing RK missions and selling that loot to shops, maybe adding that one rare item to the player market.
Even the AIxp wasn't as good as LE Missions.
I might go back to S10 on another toon for the bosses, but nothing beyond that.
When the stars burn out and I find I lack the strength to continue...one of YOU will pick up the flag and carry it forward. This really isn't a corporate product anymore...it belongs to all of us. Where it goes is up to us.
Means, Game Director (2008-2011)
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