Economic effects of the "updating" of sector 10 loot table.

[Mesa]

The way AI armor was brought into the game was just wrong.
Brainafk, almost never ending farming for way too powerful armor.
If FC had designed ofab as a replacement, the players that spent years for the AI armor sets would have gone emo.

[Kuegen]

tbh i never really think of AI armor as that powerful. Defense wise, you get a little aad and some HP, or a solid amount of evades. In PvM i'm hesitant to give up the mods from the armor I have for AI armor. Its more of a necessity for PvP, rather than OP.

[Armus]

Ofab was an option, yet AI armor remains.

Ofab is still an option as are other sets. AI armour is the best choice for some slots still which is fine. Myself I use 5 pieces of ofab and 4 pieces of ai armour on my 220 sol.

[Manicmouse]

Yeah AI armour isn't the be all end all.

My doc wears none, my crat wears almost full CSS, and my other toons have a mixed setup.

[Pomidor]

I didn't think off, that s10 change will impact market and prices, but it did. I am wondering, why no ICE there? This looks simple:

No CRU in s10 -> Higher price for CRU ottal due high demand -> Bigger price+lack ICE on market -> Less spawns -> Combined armor goes higher in price...

[Dragocze]

I didn't think off, that s10 change will impact market and prices, but it did. I am wondering, why no ICE there? This looks simple:

No CRU in s10 -> Higher price for CRU ottal due high demand -> Bigger price+lack ICE on market -> Less spawns -> Combined armor goes higher in price...

Cost of CRU is really tiny part of Combined cost. How many ices do you need to farm CC? How much that ices cost and how much CC cost? It would be something like 2% of price. If cost of CRU go to 200% cost of CC would go up to 102%. Biggest part of CC cost is farmer's time.

[Nanofat]

In my view - the sector 10 Nerf was roughly equivalent to the Ingot nerf all those years ago.
Essentially a vasty simple and readily available credits source was entirely deleted from the game.

The only essential difference being that it didn't take a much effort to produce an NT for the job of kiting hecklers back then, infact most NTs around that time were probably born for the purpose of ingot farming. More better-equipped professions have been thrown out into the cold with this change.

Even I - a kiter with 20 empty bags for ingots; had to admit post-nerf that the sort of credits i was pulling out of there were too much for the economy of the day to withstand for much longer.

I suspect the honest and intelligent s10 farmers to admit the same in time.

I think that the lesson to take away is that for all that happens - we keep on going. This isn't the last time FC will unleash a hail of funds upon the economy - only to realise their mistake and have to withstand the whines of those who were enjoying bathing in the sea of credits.

[Ilikethongs]

There are many ways to make money in AO, without doing s10. Unfortunately, there's simply not enough new players to prop up the economy.

[Garremp]

There are many ways to make money in AO, without doing s10. Unfortunately, there's simply not enough new players to prop up the economy.

What do you mean with "make"? Fresh money or money earned from another player? There is a pretty big sum taken out of the economy each month with the city rent. The only other income that is "fresh" money now is when you sell something to a shop or get a mission reward. FC wanted to limit the possible income to the whole economy but thats not possible with an instanced s10. So they instanced it and removed the big money income from it. And again just like the ingot nerf there is no alternative till the economy gets so poor that they need to implement the next overpowered "fresh" money source like s10 did after the ingot nerf.

PvP is dead for most classes, PvE is dead for some classes now the economy is nerfed, people will sell their citys, many people will leave serving the greater plan that nobody cares when they finally shut the servers down.

[Mastablasta]

What do you mean with "make"? Fresh money or money earned from another player? There is a pretty big sum taken out of the economy each month with the city rent. The only other income that is "fresh" money now is when you sell something to a shop or get a mission reward. FC wanted to limit the possible income to the whole economy but thats not possible with an instanced s10. So they instanced it and removed the big money income from it. And again just like the ingot nerf there is no alternative till the economy gets so poor that they need to implement the next overpowered "fresh" money source like s10 did after the ingot nerf.

PvP is dead for most classes, PvE is dead for some classes now the economy is nerfed, people will sell their citys, many people will leave serving the greater plan that nobody cares when they finally shut the servers down.

Heh, and we were doing just fine paying for cities prior to sector 10, so... your point? That sector 10 was somehow a response to a lack of credits in the game after ingots were removed? I guess that was a whole lot of money if it took what, 5-6 years to empty them out and sector 10 was WAY more money/time than ingots, so even if you're correct, which I'm sure you're not, then we're set for quite a while yet

[Kuegen]

Heh, and we were doing just fine paying for cities prior to sector 10, so... your point?

Things have changed. three craters, the coasts, instanced cities. There is probably a lot more credit drain nowadays from cities than before s10. This could potentially be a problem, but we don't know the severity of this credit drain in comparison the credit gain from pearl farming, mission rewards, etc.

But I seriously doubt bounty drops were implemented to counteract a credit drain that was preventing people from paying city rent.

[Mastablasta]

Things have changed. three craters, the coasts, instanced cities. There is probably a lot more credit drain nowadays from cities than before s10. This could potentially be a problem, but we don't know the severity of this credit drain in comparison the credit gain from pearl farming, mission rewards, etc.

But I seriously doubt bounty drops were implemented to counteract a credit drain that was preventing people from paying city rent.

A few more cities with a bit more credit drain. We'll see what's happened in a year's time. Crying about the prices of housing while everyone's still a billionaire is silly. And that's again considering that cities are now paid for by a single player instead of an organisation. My org would be able to pay for its city for the next 10 years with the money in its bank... so, if you're a single player owning a city, you're facing down that charge all by yourself. That was very likely never the intended design. But then, selling just one strong bot will let you pay rent in a small city for 6 months... so possible. But if one strongbot no longer lets you do that... well, we might see a few bachelors go homeless.

And yes, I seriously doubt that as well. that was part of the "accept the conspiracy theory to point out how silly it is" part of my post.

[Garremp]

Ingots where in the game long before cities where implemented so they got a "head start" to produce money before the big money sinks came to the game. Back in the days ingots where the cause of the second really big inflation wave, the first inflation was because of the monster-parts/blood plasma thingy. Before that four millions for a yalm was some big money for the most players and took some days maybe a week of mission farming (thats the perspective of a player that had no character at max level at that time).

I an not saying that all these effects where intended but the facts will talk for them self when more and more people will sell their cities which will lower the prices. Thats not a bad thing because it will give other orgs a chance to own a city too. The bad thing in that s10 change is that it will remove a whole market form the game without a proper replacement. I have never been to s10, not on a single character, but i made a good coin by selling com relays, crit-scopes, symbiants an the like to potential s10 twinks. So even that s10 was primary self feeding with most equipment (ai armor) the changes affect a very big secondary market.

And in your calculations you forget one little thing: Cities are the biggest money sink but even more money is leaving the game every month with old players that stop playing. They are mostly vastly rich with several mule chars and orgs to store that money and they never come back to bring back that money into the economy.

Talking about intended: does it seem intended that more and more items cost more than the cap on a single character? I want to see someone farming a 5 billion armor set in from pure self earned, new money and next to that keep with 10 real active players a big city running.

AO is kept together by duct tape and glue and a lot of heart in the community. I don't want s10 back but i can't stand that "repair" attempts that seem to destroy the game bit by bit and seem nothing but rushed and improvident.

[Mastablasta]

Farming monster parts for a yalm also took a rather long time.

Also I don't think that the vast majority of players have these billions and billions of credits. Can't say most people I know have that kind of money, I certainly don't.