Test Patch Note: SL Garden Key Change

[Pomidor]

And I thought that this "tweak" in SK rewards is only applied to Garden Keys/Sanct...

[Mastablasta]

If you didn't do it in the first place, then the SK changes to them doesn't matter. Other things are the problem.

[Aiken]

Yet another stupid change.... Thanks.

This game will be completely fixed, and everything will work exactly as the Devs want them to, just at the moment the door slams shut behind the last player.

Well that kinda sums it up nicely with odd changes like this.

[Ahndracorvid]

AOID 295120: Scheol Mission Reward (QL 1)

This item will give you a percentage of a level if you are below level 130 and 4015760 xp if you are above level 130.

Okay when I said earlier that I was concerned about the playfield quests being hard to do at the intended level, I was working on the basis that I'd regard, say, late TL4 - early TL5 as being an appropriate level to be running around in Adonis.

But now I'm concerned that someone in the dev office might be slightly out of touch with the practical difficulty level of some of these quests. And please don't take that the wrong way because I don't mean to offend anyone, it's just that I strongly feel some feedback from the players on the difficulty of these quests at certain level ranges would help put things into better perspective.

Scheol quest by 130? Key quests I could understand but the big long scientists/yuttos questline that runs through the playfield? I did that while leveling my first paid toon at around level 147 (ie. what I thought was the "intended" level range during which to start working on this questline) and I still needed TL7 help from orgmates/friends at several points along the way...

So I have difficulty seeing a team of 120ish toons completing it on their own. This seems kinda unreasonable. :\

[Kron]

I have to add my vote to saying the change in reward really suggests to me that FC is seriously out of communication with players. I saw today a series of yalms in tow going round clicking towers. The game is dwindling for one main reason - funcom is very out of communication with what people want and erroneosly think they know what is best.

[Aeliniyah]

So I have difficulty seeing a team of 120ish toons completing it on their own. This seems kinda unreasonable. :\

Heh... Have you ever seen a team in Scheol for anything? Or have you tried putting one together for the quests? Even if a team of 120's could complete the quest, the hell will freeze over before you find a team for a quest that takes some 5-8 hours to complete, in a zone that's empty most of the time. And thats a generous estimate since there's a lot of item hunting etc that involves random droprates.

So, unreasonable indeed. And this was completely unneccessary "fix" again. I don't mind the keyquest though, because i rarely skip those myself. Oh well, i do skip scheol keys and ado sanctuary, but all the rest i ususally do asap because i hate traveling in SL without them.

[Scudah]

If you didn't do it in the first place, then the SK changes to them doesn't matter. Other things are the problem.

Every man and his dog did the majority of these quests well past their intended level range. Why? Because it was the only way to get through the tedium of the grind fest that is getting to 220. I could understand "fixing" (note the heavy handed sarcasm)this issue if they also rolled a fix out to the problem. The problem being that an ass load of sk is needed to get to 220, not even considering research and other options to achieve said sk are extremely boring, involve no challenge (not saying doing quests aimed at lvl 130 were challenging btw), hold no form of a story and are a dull repetitive grind. When did fixing things that really weren't broken and alienating the dwindling player base ever become a priority? I'd really love to hear the reasoning behind nerfing the rewards, if it's all part of the master plan then I can pack up my soap box and move on, I just don't think the effect this is going to have has been considered at all. The is a worrying precedent, and the blanket nerf to all quests and not just key quests as stated in the patch notes posted by the OP is concerning too. Yay for poor communication. I think a lot of people would have been vocal in their condemnation had this been known.

[Notcrattey]

This change doesn't bother me in the least.

[Lazy]

because of this patch my 215 sold is stuck without garden keys past ely garden and more importantly without the 2% reflect thingie. thanks a lot, devs.

[Gorathon]

because of this patch my 215 sold is stuck without garden keys past ely garden and more importantly without the 2% reflect thingie. thanks a lot, devs.

Haha, good one, Lazy.

I agree with where this thread is going: much of the quest content is too difficult for the intended level, even with a full team; the SK previously offered for keys and quests made the last few levels manageable (not enjoyable or fast, but doable); and the devs really need to talk us through their thinking, particularly since this keys and quests used to help get toons where Ilaliya said they're supposed to be.

I need some measure of comfort that they're hearing the playerbase. I feel like the devs are analogous to the out-of-touch politician who doesn't know the price of a gallon of milk.

[cybertron]

Just did the Scheol scientist and yutto's quests, rewards are still as per before(ie.quite a few daily mission rewards). Did it on a 217 shade, thank god for enough IP to max runspeed and an engi to recall me everywhere otherwise I would have had a brain aneurism a few hours ago...

So I'm hoping that, as per what I said before, they made a mistake in official patch notes and it should have said just for key quests and not for all quests. I would not want to do this quest at a low level...even at this level, it was painful enough.

[Pomidor]

it has been said by Means, that SL quest qill be looked into, to make them easier and more straight-forward. I believe (Or, at least I would like to believe) that current change has something to do with it. Other way, most of those quest are aimed only for hardcore twinkers (vide NT reflect nano or Trader nano or some brain ado symbs for certain professions...).

[Rurounin]

Great, even more inferno grinding. It's 2012, MMO's has evolved and with this patch AO is de-evolving.

Inferno is boring, tedious and you spend at least half the time there looking for a team, when I don't feel like dual logging one of my 220's then I better be prepared to wait a couple of hours (it even took me 3 hours last time to get a team on my 216 almost-fully-decked-out Crat, and that's saying a lot). Believe it or not, I want to play on the character I'm levling, not on my already maxed out characters with the current project on follow.

I can almost guarantee that this changes nothing, the level ranges those quests are intended for will result in them not being done in the first place, more people will be without keys, because the majority of the people levling today are half AFK from 80 to 160. And then they are on /follow from 161-220, people aren't even playing!

This pisses me off, the game has a low population, you can't do content because no one is doing it and new players are getting tired of the game way before they make it to TL7. And you remove an important part of levling, that has been widely used for the last year, without adding any additions to the already existing grind. You're saying rebalance this, engine this, screw that. Do something about the grind after Ely, now, not later. You're taking way to much time on your promises (yeah yeah, it's nothing new), you're adding speed instances that's done by the majority in a couple of days. But you're completely neglecting the levling experience. Don't add more dailies, people doesn't care. They do it while they read the guide on ao-universe (well, most of them at least).

Funcom, the game aint dead yet, but it looks an awful lot like you want it to be.
And I'm done ranting... For now.

[Dagget]

The Devs are adjusting the Garden/Sanctuary Key rewards because it is the right thing to do for the game and that situation. That a 215 char would get a massive SK boost from tagging 3 Dreaming Silvertails in Nascence is not how the quest was intended and that is now -corrected-. If you still want to do it at 215 though, go ahead - no one is stopping you.

That the population is currently low is irrelevant - it might as well be zero as they are doing this to balance out game elements for when the engine is out and they advertise and pull in a new crowd, not to pacify a small group power leveling now.

[Traderjill]

That the population is currently low is irrelevant - it might as well be zero as they are doing this to balance out game elements for when the engine is out and they advertise and pull in a new crowd, not to pacify a small group power leveling now.

This is where we disagree. I think it is very relevant that the population is currently extremely low. The people still playing are loyal and trying to 'hang in there' until all of the new content comes out. Why make it tougher on those individuals now when they could just add these types of changes in the same patch that is going to make hecklers run away from players that are too hgih to gain xp?

I could go on about this but... even Means recognized that you can't remove things that people are using to level faster without fixing the underlieing issues in the game. Check out the thread that's from for a pretty intelligent discussion on the issue. In this case we were discussing OST teams but reality is that the concept applies to anything in game that people are using to level faster, possibly in a way that wasn't initially intended by the game developers.

The OST mechanics is not something I particularly like...but it is something pretty easy to find in most MMOs right now. As previously mentioned removing it is quite correctly a double edged sword in terms of social interaction and progression.

I don't agree with the assessment of Daily Missions as damaging to the game as the social element of the game is still incredibly important with respect to obtaining end game equipment. I also don't agree that AO is more top-heavy than anything else and am certain that people don't race to the end-game to "gain access to content". No matter how much content is placed at the intervening levels people will always take any opportunity to skip that content if there is not an essential item/skill/thing that can only be obtained at that location. The concept of whether the content being skipped is "fun" or not does not even come into the calculation for vet players. Fun becomes a non-issue the X'th time you have done it when you only have an end-goal in mind. Again with respect the social element, AO requires more team participation than almost anything out there. I do however agree that the mountain to climb to 220/30/70+gear is far too high and certainly prevents most people from enjoying more than one profession. The magnitude of this climb certainly drives players (even regular players who have not already leveled x alts.) towards mechanics like OST and Kiting. That being said it is important to remember every shortcut that is even "perceived" will be heavily used.

So quite correctly OST+Kiting is not the real issue but more a symptom of the underlying problem. Properly identifying and implementing a solution to this issue is certainly not going to be as simple as removing OST mechanics.

As the last sentence states.. what the heck were they really trying to accomplish with this 'fix'? You can't just go and make everything as it was initially intended without fixing anything else, lol.

[Dagget]

Yep, different opinion.

In any case, the statement at the start of the thread has been answered and the changes are in place on live.

Hecklers fleeing is subject of different threads, and my opinions on that are posted as well.

[Rosss]

That a 215 char would get a massive SK boost from tagging 3 Dreaming Silvertails in Nascence is not how the quest was intended and that is now -corrected-. If you still want to do it at 215 though, go ahead - no one is stopping you.

And yet, I get just as massive SK, even more so since I can do it unlimited number of times, from just walking around tagging 3 posters, or 5 towers. Or killing 3 lvl 1 notum miners in an empty playfield, or training 100 rollerrats around that don't even hit me. I don't see the problem here. They should remove those dailys too then.

[Ramany]

More than anything, this last patch convinced me that this game is currently not going in the right direction. Unwanted so-called "fixes" to quests that were giving a nice SK boost, and would alleviate the boredom of grinding inferno missions and repetitive daily quests. S10 "fixing" that makes it an absolutely useless playfield, unless you go farm if for hours with a full team hoping to find relays : I used to enjoy logging my 150 Keeper to solo a little there and get a few ICE''s and maybe hope for the random luck of a relay, when I had only limited time online. It was fun and there still was a purpose : today, there is no point at all going there.
Luckily enough, FC brought some essential cosmetic changes like :
*'Improved Nano Repulsor' and 'Improved Instinctive Control' can be used by Agents in False Profession.
*The 'Cerset Zapper Rifle' range is increased to match the 'Solar-Powered Rifle'.
*The cooldown of 'Shadowlands Recall Beacon' available from the Veteran vendor is lowered to match the Rubi-Ka version.
* We fixed various typos

I am also extremely thrilled that the SL Keys icons have been "polished"....

I was toying with the idea of opening up a 2nd account, and level 2 toons at the same time, to make up for the lack of teams : the last patches not only convinced me not to do so, but also to stop the pointless grinding on my main account.
On my 214 Engy, the last week, I haven't managed to do one single Inf Mish because nobody was LFT or LFM; 201-214 BS never started, and when it did, it aborted after a few minutes due to lack of players.
Only thing left was grinding dailies.....
Where is the fun after you have done the same daily over 50 times ?
Tried to solo dungeons : everything is grey to me in Penumbra and Inferno dungeons are almost unsoloable (takes ages to kill 1 mob if it's yellow/orange and impossible if it's red)

I have tried another sci-fi MMO that's just out and whose name begins with SW and ends with TOR : nothing comparable to AO for sure, but at least I was able to enjoy the storyline, I was guided in my progress, had some fun quests that developped with the story line and allowed me to discover the planet while levelling up. I no longer felt like I had a job to do to go to the next level, which is what I felt more and more in AO.

I haven't logged in for 10 days or so and don't feel the need to do it either : thank you Funcom, I am no longer addicted.
If nothing changes in the game, I know what will happen when my subscription ends up, despite all the fun and emotions I had during all those years.

PS : I know people will tell me to make a team, to twink harder, to do this or to do that.
The fact is I am no longer interested : been there, done that too much : the fun is out....

[Iriche]

I ahve grinded missions for 5h-6h the last days, so not sure what you are doing when looking for team - but you are clearly doing it wrong

[Alternity]

I ahve grinded missions for 5h-6h the last days, so not sure what you are doing when looking for team - but you are clearly doing it wrong

Not that simple Iri, both my crate and shade can sit on lft for hours. I usually give up after 2-3 tho. Would mention that both are in top gear. If such classes have issues, I'm surely can understand how hard it is on others.