Soju's Multiboxing Guide

[Traderjill]

I would like to think that the reasons MB was deemed legal had something to do with the developers thinking about what I just posted and not some random decision. But some of you will probably think I am giving them too much credit.

If you read the quote I posted from Genele in regards to multiboxing, you'll see that she commented on Macrosun approaching a fix for multiboxing in PvP from a coding perspective and came up empty so she opted to approach it from a game design perspective and tossed out what she felt would be some fixes. Let me state, I think what she suggested was utterly retarded but the fact of the matter is that she was trying to fix it so that multiboxing didn't adversely impact PvP. The thing is, at that time, people were saying 'multiboxing is ok in PvM' so no one bothered to look for any sort of design fix for its PvM implications. I suspect that as more and more people multibox, you'll see more people complaining about its use in PvM and they'll need to figure something out.

***Remember I don't use MB, but I can see bigger picture of what requests like this can lead to, there a LOT of things we take for granted in this game as useful and helpful. Can you imagine AO without them?

Yep, we (as a game society.. not necessarily me personally on all of these) use Clicksaver/Mishbuddy, AOIA, in-game map upgrades and org bots. Yes, they bring a lot of improvements to the table and could be perceived to be violations of the EULA.. but Funcom has allowed them to exist. Besides some obscure reasoning (very obscure) I can't imagine people coming up with legit reasons why these things should be banned from game. I will point you to a legit reason why bots need to be reviewed in this thread, however, but that's a topic for another place. Outside of that (someone really abusing the freedoms we've been allowed), I don't see those 3rd party tools adversely affecting any decent portion of the population in the same way that multiboxing has in just the past year alone.

Whether I agree with most posters/players, or not, I do respect the intelligence of most of those I tend to go back and forth with. I simply can't believe that people don't have the ability to differentiate between programs that are perceived as 95% good/5% bad versus programs that are perceived as 50% good/50% bad (being generous there.. I don't think 50% of the AO players would say multiboxing is good for the game).

[Caloss2]

You can't reason with a mensa troll Jill, they always somehow believe they have more insight or a view to a larger picture than everybody else; even when they totally miss the point.

[Psikie]

Whether I agree with most posters/players, or not, I do respect the intelligence of most of those I tend to go back and forth with. I simply can't believe that people don't have the ability to differentiate between programs that are perceived as 95% good/5% bad versus programs that are perceived as 50% good/50% bad (being generous there.. I don't think 50% of the AO players would say multiboxing is good for the game).

Well honestly Jill and I can be honest with you if no one else. I don't really like MultiBoxing. Although I would not turn down a raid that had players using it. I can of course see the negatives from pvp and pvm.

I really just like to debate (2 years law school I no longer can afford lol), and I like to take the under dogs position. I also like to see how a point of view can be taken to extremes in the strictest sense of the law. So when a question of legality comes on the forums I like to point out how the law can work both for and against you sometimes. I walk around with a buyer beware mentality and be careful what you wish for motto.

So there are times when I debate just for the heck of it because im bored, but at least it sparks conversation, thinking, and on a few occasions brought people around to a different point of view and/or line of thinking.

You can't reason with a mensa troll Jill,

NomNomNom your words are candy to me. <These are not the quote quotes you are looking for...we can go about our way and move along now.>

[Traderjill]

Well honestly Jill and I can be honest with you if no one else. I don't really like MultiBoxing. Although I would not turn down a raid that had players using it. I can of course see the negatives from pvp and pvm.

You reminded me of something that I failed to mention in all of my walls of text in this thread. There are not very many people in AO that I call a friend, but one that I do is a multiboxer. I have indeed joined at least a couple gauntlets where he sped his way to the top and I ended up with a full SSC piece as a result. In other words PvM where there was competition for a mob. When I was doing it (pre-server merge, over 2 years ago) it didn't dawn on me that what I was participating in might be negatively impacting someone else's experience. I've had many heated discussions with him over the use of multiboxing, but it was almost always in relation to PvP (though I have mentioned trickle-down effects on PvM but didn't consider it a significant concern).

It wasn't until it started happening to me that I saw the problem. So I get why people, in this thread, are arguing against the point. Sometimes you have to be on the receiving end (or have the ability to empathize) in order to understand what someone else is going through.

Anyway, my last post in this thread.

[Hide]

It's funny to see the abilitie of people to stay on topic.

The topic subject was : Soju's Multiboxing Guide
And not : Discuss about Multiboxing.


I can imagine you all at work IRL...

Boss : Hey, here is a guide I made to improve our competitivity in our business. Let me know what do you think, and how to improve it please.
Employee : You know Boss, I think we need to change the world, because blablabla

Damn forum troller

Just saying ^^

[Poko]

Its cuhz someone killed a dyna they wanted, hahaha.

Imagine irl..Someone took the last box of twinkiez, instead of going to a different store, they write a petition, to get signed and discussed about by the government.

[Traderjill]

It's funny to see the abilitie of people to stay on topic.

The topic subject was : Soju's Multiboxing Guide
And not : Discuss about Multiboxing.


I can imagine you all at work IRL...

Boss : Hey, here is a guide I made to improve our competitivity in our business. Let me know what do you think, and how to improve it please.
Employee : You know Boss, I think we need to change the world, because blablabla

Damn forum troller

Just saying ^^

While your belief that my derailing this thread is somehow a reflection on my RL worth ethic is flawed, I do agree that this thread was derailed. Technically, my first post was actually in response to a post by Soju (that started the thread) but nevertheless I'm smart enough to understand the general concept of being off-topic.

I have asked the forum mods to move my posts and their responses to their own thread... though the convo started a month before I posted.

Its cuhz someone killed a dyna they wanted, hahaha.


Imagine irl..Someone took the last box of twinkiez, instead of going to a different store, they write a petition, to get signed and discussed about by the government.

Wow that would totally be the wrong approach. It would make way more sense to talk to the manager of the store, find out if there are more twinkies in stock and, if not, get the name of the person responsible for inventory management and report them to the corporate headquarters for the franchise for failure to have a sufficient stock of twinkies on hand. If that report didn't result in an immediate apology and free lifetime supply of twinkies then you should call in to the local news stations and let them know what's going on. I mean there are way more steps to take before you even remotely get to petitions.whitehouse.gov level.

[Psikie]

It's funny to see the abilitie of people to stay on topic.

The topic subject was : Soju's Multiboxing Guide
And not : Discuss about Multiboxing. ^^

Its cuhz someone killed a dyna they wanted, hahaha.

Imagine irl..Someone took the last box of twinkiez, instead of going to a different store, they write a petition, to get signed and discussed about by the government.

Shots FIRED!!!

The forums are ripe today with strife happy Columbus day~

[Hide]

You didn't need to justify yourself Jill, I wasn't pointing you at all.
It was more like a general observation, not only on this thread

[Soju]

<3 poko stopped by /blush

[Transform]

While your belief that my derailing this thread is somehow a reflection on my RL worth ethic is flawed, I do agree that this thread was derailed. Technically, my first post was actually in response to a post by Soju (that started the thread) but nevertheless I'm smart enough to understand the general concept of being off-topic.








Wow that would totally be the wrong approach. It would make way more sense to talk to the manager of the store, find out if there are more twinkies in stock and, if not, get the name of the person responsible for inventory management and report them to the corporate headquarters for the franchise for failure to have a sufficient stock of twinkies on hand. If that report didn't result in an immediate apology and free lifetime supply of twinkies then you should call in to the local news stations and let them know what's going on. I mean there are way more steps to take before you even remotely get to petitions.whitehouse.gov level.

Wrong. I'll root/calm that fellow that killing steal my twinkies, ubt+aimshoot+fullauto+fling+burst+sneakattack that fellow till to death!!!!

Oh nvm... Forgot this is real life incident.

[Cratertina]

A big shout out for Soju!

:P Dat man helped me with his multibox team complete Battlerod and Xarx dragons in Inferno.

I did observe him a lot during our adventure in to inferno.

#1 Multiboxing is a form of twinking.
#2 He placed a lot of effort in to his toons, much more than many endgamers one sees.
#3 He is doing it right.

I challenge any naysayer to do it better.

[Soju]

Thank you for the nice words tina!!

[McKnuckleSamwich]

I got some questions that I'd like to pose to the community who do MB.

First of all, I first have to be up front about this because I don't think it's fair to try to play two fiddles, so I just want to clarify my stance on MB.
Basically I only had one account for probably my first 3 years or so playing AO and one day I got a new account. I started paying it and I used it for buffing and I built a few toons on that account. It wasn't until a few years later that I ever even considered using both accounts at once. Fast forward another few years and me and a mate were regularly 2 manning instances, but the method was always alt-tab. Later on maybe a year or so ago I only started learning about multiboxing. I tried it a bit but wasn't very good at it but it was very clear to me that there was a LOT of power in it, if only I learned how to operate it better.

Now I have 5 accounts paid, and another one which isn't paid. I'm considering activating to have a full team of 6 with which I can create teams for solo MB play. most stuff I've tried doing to date, I can just as easily do with 4 man team working in coordination as I could do with 6 (or so I thought).

I've tried MB in PVP, and while I thought the advantage was clear, I've since abstained from MBing in PVP since I feel it affords too much advantage and doesn't make the game enjoyable. I do PVP for enjoyment, and I've always, always been a honourable player: I don't cheat, I don't play dirty, and if someone beats me when I've used all allowed advantages, then I'll tell him he played well. that said, since the proliferation of MB in PVP, I've become a bit of a recluse and haven't found as much enjoyment in the PVP aspect of play as I used to.

That said, I'm thoroughly enjoying my current account load, with a recently vetted main acc in which I've transferred a couple of twinks and built a new enforcer to complement my prof stable.

On to the discussion.

Ok, my current well rounded team is: Enf/doc/crat/keeper/soldier

This appears to be pretty much a rock solid team, with very solid defence, a designated tank, loads of burst damage and really solid long term damage with big add dmg buffs from soldier+keeper to boost team output. Under some conditions I'll even run assassin to further boost output.

When I'm playing, I like to operate my crat or doctor while the rest of the team are slaves.

Here are some of the problems I repeatedly run into:

1. emergency perks all bound to 1 key means my whole team fires emergency perks/defences even if only one of them is under threat
2. nano recharge on slaves (I like to use CH inhibitor occasionally on soldier, but realistically the big problem is doc and enf.
Specific to the Enf - the big issues I run into here are: in ideal conditions you can generate layer spam quickly, even casting on CD - but this requires /assist (hopefully self targeting) then executing the nano (I usually bind the nano and the assist to the same key so a few repetitions results in an /assist heal on doc or an /assist layer on enf) but you really also need to be casting imalice, and occasionally imongo, and if you need to move around you also need rage.

Invariably on this, there's mix ups.. I've got a few solutions that seem to make sense, but it's difficult to not waste a crap load of perks, over-use nanos which don't do your team any benefit and keep damage up when there are many mobs and/or aggro flickers.

Here is how I've set up most of my toons for damage dealing:
#3 = /assist leader + fast attack/burst/bone eater/first+second SL weapon perks for melee/wrath/ all RE dmg perks/ taunters /work place depression/pet attack/mistreatment/viral combination/AI perks on doc/anti fear on keeper/flurry of blows on all melee

#2 = /assist leader fling/brawl/full auto/3rd+4th SL weapon dmg perks for melee/1st-2nd SL dmg perks for ranged/some dodge debuffs on sold/rest of fast AI perks

#1 = any remaining high damage SL perks (deadeye)/all starfall perks/some slower AI perks/bio rejuv/any small team heal perks/imalice/Scythe omega virus

#4 = ILC/Overrule/suppressive horde/energize/imongo/Insight/clipfever/AOE dmg perks

E = all remaining perks/slow execution AI perks (bot confinement etc.)/ only use on longer boss fights where mob won't be dead by the time they execute; rage, mutagenic parasite or whatever the last dot is

R = /assist on all toons, stim, BI, superior fortify, lay on hands (this basically allows all team members to contribute to healing directly of HP and nano)

T = emergency! coon/Devotional armour/AMS/lifeblood/Bioregrowth/blessing/ICH
(to activate the targeted heals/perks, you have to press EITHER F1 then T, or R then T (to assist the aggro target).

F = /follow. usually just press F2 then F to get all toons following the leader in the team. The leader of the team always occupies the second slot in the team after yourself, unless shuffling or leadership changes has occurred.

Basically this setup allows me to keep my team buffed, assisting, able to heal the target of aggression and doesn't over use perks (i.e minimize perk executions on corpses). I can get all dots up using 3/1/E, I can heal/tank using R spam paired with 1 for single target aggro generation.

the issues that I feel might arise is that it may be better to switch R and 1 on the tank for nano casts: if R spam generates healing aggro, then maybe tank should be casting imalice to counter heal spam aggro. further, using 1 on enf to generate layers is effective as well because it's the nano you want to be spamming most.

So that's the hotkeying I have been using so far and in general the only problems I have is confliction of nano recharge - but I honestly don't see a way around it since even when I'm playing enf/doc I'm constantly casting and waiting for nano recharge anyway.

Sorry, my question is what other hotkeys do people use to accomplish good perk/special/nano spam distributions while being able to function effectively?

[Esqi]

All can suggest is using shift +1/2 etc for diff perks, you can also key map certain hot bar actions for 1 toon only.

Requires alot more micro managing but you gain more.

Fwiw im in same boat acc wise.

[Wakizaka]

2. nano recharge on slaves (I like to use CH inhibitor occasionally on soldier, but realistically the big problem is doc and enf.
Specific to the Enf - the big issues I run into here are: in ideal conditions you can generate layer spam quickly, even casting on CD - but this requires /assist (hopefully self targeting) then executing the nano (I usually bind the nano and the assist to the same key so a few repetitions results in an /assist heal on doc or an /assist layer on enf) but you really also need to be casting imalice, and occasionally imongo, and if you need to move around you also need rage.

Just a note, you don't need to target yourself to cast Superior Fortify, as it's self only.
Greater Fortify, and all lower QL layer nanos can be cast on a target though.

[Dochere]

Keybinds are your best friend, I spam 1 key on my master and all 5 slaves also spam the same key. That way whenever I spam my "all-in-one-attack-key" all toons assist master as well as fire off 1-6 bars of attacks perks + 1 nano or multiple nanos if they have their own cooldowns. (ICH -> BI)

<HotKey ScrollLockOn Z>
    <SendLabel Master, Slave1, Slave2, Slave3, Slave4, Slave5>
        <Key %Trigger%>

[Adeptall2]

Sorry, my question is what other hotkeys do people use to accomplish good perk/special/nano spam distributions while being able to function effectively?

Simple answer, just about every key available on my keyboard. All the keys within quick reach of my left hand (basically numbers up to 5-6 and as far over as T/G for the letters) i activate with my left hand. The rest i bind to my G600 mouse. With the use of the g600s g-shift key you have 32-34 bindable buttons. I'm using something over 20. You can even use hotkeynet to clickmouse on specific locations and on specific windows (provided those windows are not minimized). So when i press for example G-Shift+G15 key on my mouse all my pet professions pop a new bot and start casting another shell.

Combination of hotkeynets options and delays and everything else and a g600 is quite powerful.

[Soju]

Thx mcknuckle i got to read a nice story before post get removed.

[Psikie]

Stuff

Combination of hotkeynets options and delays and everything else and a g600 is quite powerful.

I had really been on the fence about this MB thing as I have to this day never had any experience using it myself, and the 2-3x I've "assumed" it was being used were in a raid were we were missing soldier on follow for reflects or fixer for ncu/runspeed. So I didn't really see the big deal even so far as debating in this thread. Mainly because I don't like bullies and some of the posters against seemed like they were trying to bully the OP.

But after speaking with Soju in game (thank you for taking time out for me), and reading these posts I have a slightly different outlook. Without shame I have dual logged with alt-tab plenty of times. Usually either my 220mp or 220keep on follow for heal pet or keep DD boost on lowbie SL toons lvl 2-50ish. By then I twink a little and standard leveling and teams have never been a problem for me to get. Other than some db3 items and a few toons without gauntlet pads I really don't need anything in game.

I have tried some dual log things but it's never been more than play 1 toon and just atl tab to hit Q on the 2nd toon. Ive never tried MB before because it just looked so damn complicated with all the hashtag this and trigger that stuff. Between work and family my game time is limited so I just like to load up and play.

But now curiosity is really getting the best of me and I think I will give this a try sometime over the weekend.