Open letter

[Jasper2002]

To all.

I have been a long term subscriber that has been away a while.

Why, because there is only so long you can repeat the same thing before it becomes a job.

I, like many, have been waiting for the new engine, I lost a lots of players, friends due to this proposed upgrade a long time ago. Many promised to return when the update happened.

I love this environment, I love the lore. The story, emphasis and cooperation of players is unique.

People I know live here, love here and create here.

Here I plead with you.

You are not competing with the latest RPG's.

Pick a platform and make it work. Honestly I don't care about the graphics, but if that is what you think is what will increase your user base then fine. We have lost more than you would gain with a new engine by broken promises.

Pick it, make it work, release it.

Professions balance is and always will a work in progress.

If you want to make eye candy do it and move on.

If you get over this constant promise of the game engine improvement I for one will return, just tell the truth.

Look, we love the game, just make it work, next stage, move on. Promises of a beautiful world fail next to a realistic, complex world that drives our intelligence, intrigue and a community that outclasses anything in the online world, for maturity, respect and the ability to answer a simple question with a simple answer, without relying on sarcasm, or being a complete 12 year old.

Please bring me back to a world I love, in a way I know. Antialising sucks if you don't know how to wield it, give me GA and SMG anyday.

Tron04

[Xatgunner]

Amen

[Bothead]

I'm with you 100% Jasp!

*goes back to luck in shadows*

[Phatkeep]

The last patch is excellent. Quality of life stuff, sensible stuff.

[Pafpuf]

The last patch is excellent. Quality of life stuff, sensible stuff.

I wouldn't go as far as to call it excellent. Mission exits are nice and long overdue. Ofab shoulderpads should have been finished over 7 years go. Gunships for the few remaining neutrals in this game. Still no focus on actual problems that only keep stacking and don't get me started on the free xp for slackers initiative also known as 3x bs daily where people are dragged into a pvp area without any intention of pvping and if someone who actually wants to pvp shows up and kills a leveling character they're looked upon as the cancer that's killing this game. Besides I had a very long and reasonable argument in how fc should make pvp areas appealing to actual pvpers (with very simple changes) and naturally the thread was ignored until someone came with a redundant "when is halloween patch up?" question. A week before halloween, literally the same time as every year duh. Kinda sad that diehard players in this game are so starved for changes they raise a man to the heavens for giving them breadcrumbs :p

[Psikie]

don't get me started on the free xp for slackers initiative also known as 3x bs daily where people are dragged into a pvp area without any intention of pvping and if someone who actually wants to pvp shows up and kills a leveling character they're looked upon as the cancer that's killing this game.

Such a Debbie Downer, especially since you have been harping about "incentives" for pvp for like...ever. Now you got it and still complain. sheesh

You are the ultimate hypocrite, you say you want pvp, but don't like pvm players in BS. You want incentive for BS pvp from rewards that attract pvm players to make it run. Then you say you don't like killing greenies and pvm players but still do every chance you get. Then when you get the gift horse you look it in the mouth and complain.

On top of it all you just don't get it. Nobody really cares that you play how ever you want spawn camping and chasing down the same pvm players you say you don't want to see on BS.

You are self defeating your own goals! Go ahead find the ripest target and kill him 6x per round for all I care, but don't come back and QQ that BS is empty because no one wants to come and get farmed by you.

It would be totally different if you popped someone once or twice and sent them a tell, every time you come to Core im gonna zap you. But that's not what happens, players hunt the same target religiously passing up other players in that search so they can farm the same player.

Seriously? Is it any wonder why people don't want to play under those type of scenarios? Not like they can even learn anything because they never get a chance to experience pvp, they just go in and get griefed, farmed, and ridiculed (L2P, get better gear, etc, etc).

I was lucky that never happened to me or I would never have gone back to BS more than once and I would have just bought OFAB I wanted from players. But I've seen it happen at least 90% of the hundreds of times ive been in BS. That's not saying there is anything wrong with that playstyle, kinda douchie but nothing wrong with it.

But don't act all like the victim when your own playstyle drives away any potential new players you could have on a regular basis. Or when you get players that just run around capping because they don't want to spend entire time in decon. Or the ones that just go to a corner and /sneak to avoid twink farmers.

If you have any siblings think of it like this...a 4 foot tall 10 yr old want to play basketball with his 6 foot tall 18 yr old brother. How many times is that 10 yr old going to want to play if the older brother blocks every shot attempt, steals the ball, and slam dunks on the kid? Obviously the kid never stood a chance but if the older brother wants him to keep playing he must nurture the young padawan and even though he won't win a single game at least let him make a few shots to feel good about his self. Does this make ANY sense at all, does this not sound reasonable?

[Pafpuf]

And there's the slander commander always ready to counter my reasonable argument with unrelated imaginary stories and putting words in my mouth in order to make me or any other pvper look bad. Very low and very selfish of you.

[Technorabbit]

No, Paf, he's absolutely correct.

Your style of arguing made it way harder to enjoy the game.

"Hurr if I whine enough on the forums I can make PVMers suffer!"

[Pafpuf]

LOL funcom designs missions that force pvmers into pvp areas, force feeding people who do not want to pvp to actual pvpers and when I make suggestions that would help people participate in content they prefer with nobody losing anything I'm the one who wants to make pvmers suffer. Honestly I facepalmed irl upon reading that.

If I liked farming gimps or wanted to make pvmers suffer I'd be playing this game right now and farming them on the battlestation. But that's not what I do, I do not want to pvp against fricken gimps no matter how many times the slander commander psikie tries to make it look like it's my preference.

I honestly don't know what's wrong with you people, are you trolling me or just have serious reading comprehension problems? My style of arguing is based on analytical, rational thinking and I try my best to explain the processes behind my ideas when someone questions them. If all you get from that is "hurr she whines on the forums" that's clearly an error on your part, maybe you should have picked up a book more often during your development stage.

[Psikie]

Look I don't know if you are a guy or girl, either way you are not analytical you are emotional in your arguments.

You got what you wanted, "rewards" for pvp on BS, but still aren't satisfied. You can't realistically think pvm players are not going to take part in those "rewards". The same time you say the rewards are going to allow you to have more chances at pvp, which is correct, but then you turn around and say you don't want to compete against gimps/greenies/pvm/levelers etc. WHO DID YOU THINK NEEDED REWARDS??? Not the twinks that are already setup derp derp.

I could care less how you play AO, I don't care if you spawn cap or do any other unsportsmanlike behavior. What bothers me is this attitude that only the best of the best pvp players should be on BS at your leisure to play against, but then QQ about getting this big carrot "reward" to dangle in front of pvm players to come and make BS run. Then you complain about it them being there...after you gave them reason to come. ROFLOL

The only thing I try to impart upon you is that IF you want to keep them coming, make it fun for them. Even just a little bit of fun might motivate them to return. If you make it miserable every time, they will never return once they no longer need the reward. derp derp

(btw THAT would be an analytical, rational argument)

[Pafpuf]

How does exp reward a 220/30/70 character? You obviously have reading comprehension problems as I've extensively discussed the matter previously and you continuously twist my words.

You could care less how I play but you care just enough to make up stories about how I play with pretty much every post you make addressing me. Yeah, how very rational of you.

[Psikie]

How does exp reward a 220/30/70 character? You obviously have reading comprehension problems as I've extensively discussed the matter previously and you continuously twist my words.

Look, you just answered your own question. 220/30/70 xp is not a reward, WHAT DID YOU SUGGEST AS AN ALTERNATIVE TO XP? I do not remember you having any. What did you expect for a "reward" when the thread was about 3x daily on BS?!?! Does a 220/30/70 toon need another piece of Combined for a reward? More credits? A different title system?

Listen, I don't find much to do on BS anymore, I made a lot of kills with my tigress and if I saw jack wagons spawn camping or hunting greenies in the hundreds of times ive been on BS I did one of 2 things.

1. Swap out my bow for zset and just 4 capped to end the round as quickly as possible, I think record round was under 4 min for my side.
2. Load up my NT and just blind-root-double- triple the a$$ hats till they left.

So again how you or anyone plays on BS does not really bother me the point was and still is you not understanding basic human principals of common sense. If you want players to come to BS scroll up or look at some of my other posts on the topic. The whole "reward" me for pvp is total snow job. When people make subway, totw/ foremans/ twinks, they do it because it is FUN not because some reward. Pvp should be fun and that would be it's own reward to make people WANT to do it. Not feel they have to do it for a reward.

If the reward attracts pvm players that make BS active don't complain about getting some of the pvp action you desire. It's really unbecoming to get something you ask for and still complain.

[Cyberleet]

Does a 220/30/70 toon need another piece of Combined for a reward? More credits? A different title system?

Yes, more phatz in vp-shop plz. Discount per title-lvl.

Maybe not combined or boc but; Towers, stimulants, high-ql nanos/implants/clusters etc.

Listen, I don't find much to do on BS anymore,

Cause there is no incentive to pvp

1. Swap out my bow for zset and just 4 capped to end the round as quickly as possible,

1. You sabotage game-content for a lot of players by doing that. We paid for this.
2. 4-capping should be petionable as harassement.

2. Load up my NT and just blind-root-double- triple the a$$ hats till they left.

Cool! Then some1 could log a NR-toon and then we got it going

Whompa-wars started in a similar way. A guy started ganking pvm'ers (thats equally as legit as monsters auto-attacking pvp'ers btw) on the way to foremans. Then some1 logged a higher level char to get the ganker, and then the ganker and the factionallies of the ganker wanted to retaliate that again and it finally ended up in what players refered to as 'whompa-wars'. Players who logged in to AO for pvp went to the whompa-area to check for active content to participate in.

Level 200-pvp too: TL7-bs died out and level 200-bs became the most active one since it was an incentive for players to go there. Some guy (think katrien from leet-bloc was first out on rk2) made a 200-twink to wtf-gank players and then got competition. Now it is a pvp-ground for 200's.

This illustrates how pvm and pvp interchange in AO. And I think it is good that we got pvp and pvm combined to a server. FT-pvp (not sure if rk1'ers did this) was similar. It happened around populated areas... and of course near a zone-to-safe border.

FC should learn from this instead of making more fails like 'will to fight' or 'pvp'-dailies.

The only thing I try to impart upon you is that IF you want to keep them coming, make it fun for them.

Make it fun for them on your own side yeah, but raping greenies isn't that bad. Flawed game-mechanics is.

The whole "reward" me for pvp is total snow job. When people make subway, totw/ foremans/ twinks, they do it because it is FUN not because some
reward.

Phat Lewt (and fun) has EVERYTHING to do with pvm-twinks. Thats a fact that willl remain.

Case in point; Paid services and lootright-selling.

Pvp should be fun and that would be it's own reward to make people WANT to do it.

Pvp is fun, it just have to happen.

We got some problems:

• Multiboxing and 5-min flags killed streetfighting.
• BS doesn't run.
• Tarasque gets exploited by pvm'ers.

Fix that.

MB is potent due to uber teambuffs (+meep) and special-attacks being instant.
Battlestation nees rewards so more people have a incentive to do it. A alternative to the 'Kite/ost >>> undergeared greens in inf with 220's >>> buy lootright'-stuff that is the current state of the pvm-game FC offers.

Not feel they have to do it for a reward.

Agree.

It shouldn't be so much rewards in vp-shop that you can't get via pvm, and vice versa of course.

So;

No special-editions in pvm.
No boc or combined in vp-shop.

Voila'

[Cyberleet]

FT-pvp (not sure if rk1'ers did this) was similar.

I remember just shopping stuff in FT and was omw back to pvm when I got a tell; Can you AS that guy? from a guy (pala?) in sneak. I was lowbie, but with a kyr-rifle so I could do 'something' together with some1. I failed in doing what I was supposed to do at the right time of course (timing is important), but I remember I kept coming back to it and with experience I improved my skills.

So there you have it

don't get me started on the free xp for slackers initiative also known as 3x bs daily where people are dragged into a pvp area without any intention of pvping and if someone who actually wants to pvp shows up and kills a leveling character they're looked upon as the cancer that's killing this game.

Or hatetells/harassement/exploit-accusation

[Psikie]

Yes, more phatz in vp-shop plz. Discount per title-lvl.

Maybe not combined or boc but; Towers, stimulants, high-ql nanos/implants/clusters etc.
<snip>
Cause there is no incentive to pvp
<snip>
It shouldn't be so much rewards in vp-shop that you can't get via pvm, and vice versa of course.
<snip>
So;

No special-editions in pvm.
No boc or combined in vp-shop.

Voila'

Ok you said a lot so ill just break this up a bit,

I suggested some time ago in another thread for special stims, or special towers as incentive rewards for pvp so yea great idea.

There is no incentive to pvp except desire, which is the same incentive in pvm... desire. You either desire to play or you don't. You either desire to get 220/30 or desire to /dance and socialize at lvl 5 or desire to get grand master super slayer title in pvp.

There is no "reward" or "incentive" that just makes people all the sudden say, "Man I love dealing with the a$$ hats in pvp now because of this nifty new reward! It sure is a lot more FUN now!" Don't be ridiculous. I can't say it any more plain, you should want pvm players to join BS. You NEED pvm players for BS. No one comes to AO because of the awesome pvp system, they come for the storyline or sci-fi pvm or because someone told them to join them in game. All pvp players started as pvm players. You are not replenishing your pool of players. Nor are you making it any easier to replenish them. You are cutting off your nose to spite your face.

I don't go to BS much because it's boring. I would much rather /duel someone and take their best vs my best and see who comes out on top. I'd rather take my fixer and beat up your NT or figure out a way for my soldier to beat your engi. THAT is a challenge! Not the garbage 4 on 1 gank fest while everyone kites each other around on the battle station.

Spec editions, ofab, and triple dailies are probably the only reason BS runs 75% of the time...those pvm players. You remove that and you are killing yourself. Now if you want to add some additional items that are BS playfield only like +200 aao stim for 5-10k vp's or Battle station versions of buff cans for vp's or special towers (anti-meep/anti-warp/anti-zone* perhaps) that can only be purchased with 50k vps I would vote for that all day!

[Raggy]

1. You sabotage game-content for a lot of players by doing that. We paid for this.
2. 4-capping should be petionable as harassement.

Only in AO will you find players who actually believe completing objectives is a form of harassment. What a joke.

Here's a tip for you, if you want Deathmatch PvP, go play in the Rogue Miners zone or BY Tag in Bor, it's clearly more up your street.

[Cyberleet]

Only in AO will you find players who actually believe completing objectives is a form of harassment. What a joke.

Flagging AoE-users is also harassement, even tho the game evolves around the political conflict between omni-tek and clan. What a joke.

Here's a tip for you, if you want Deathmatch PvP, go play in the Rogue Miners zone or BY Tag in Bor, it's clearly more up your street.

Miner-area is inactive. Borealis-pvp is inactive due to MB and 5min-flags.

[Traderjill]

Look, you just answered your own question. 220/30/70 xp is not a reward, WHAT DID YOU SUGGEST AS AN ALTERNATIVE TO XP? I do not remember you having any.

Except you can't loot a vendor machine or quest rewards. For example they could sell nodrop lead bots that when used in a simple tradeskill process would turn yesdrop. Then people who prefer pvp could farm the same item via pvp instead of alien raids. It's not quantum physics people.

Psikie, PafPuf's quote (above) was actually in response to you in another thread.

Yes, more phatz in vp-shop plz. Discount per title-lvl.

1. 4-capping should be petionable as harassement.

Battlestations is a side vs side objective based playfield. The game-defined goal, when you enter, is to take control of the space station. Complaining that a side caps all four points is like going to Camelot and complaining that a side killed Tara instead of leaving it alive so the battle could continue.

The harsh reality is that if one side can cap all 4 points for any significant amount of time that means that something is seriously wrong. Either people aren't defending points or there is a major power imbalance in that round.

[Psikie]

Psikie, PafPuf's quote (above) was actually in response to you in another thread.

Yes it was a "response". Terrible idea non the less. Not to go back and requote that thread here. All the back and forth aside I truly see it very simply.

1. All the end game pvp players that enjoy BS are already there.
2. Those number are not enough to sustain any longevity of play.
3. The is NO REWARD/INCENTIVE/BRIBE that will keep players going to BS after they get it, if it is not fun.

You can give out ql300 AI Bots or ACDC's, and as soon as everyone has all 8-12 character slots filled with that loot or the price drops to 10k per item because market is flooded you have empty BS again. Is that too hard to grasp, throwing xp or loot at the problem is not a solution.

The momentary influx of players looking for triple rewards will not last any longer than it did in the past. Those that do not study history are doomed to repeat it.

History lesson, BS only had 2 reasons for people to come. Vp and Xp.
Now that all the dedicated pvp players have plenty of vp's and ofab don't you get it why they don't come back much...it's not fun.
Once the pvm players lvl up to 220 from their triple xp rewards don't you get it why they don't come back for research...it's not fun.

There is no logical reason on this green earth to expect someone to spend 15-20$ a month to log on to a game and do something they do not think is fun. THATS the point being missed here. You could offer anyone ql300 bots and I doubt they would sit for an hour watching a trox /adjust in a thong every day for a month. Could anyone see themselves doing something they didn't like on a daily basis in a game that you actually had to pay monthly for?

[Xootch]

The harsh reality is that there are a major power imbalances almost every round.

fixed it (I know it doesnt relate to the context but i would like to take this opportunity to point that out for the 1 millionth time nonetheless )