CCP making changes to EULA and multi boxing rules.

[Alternity]

CCP changes

In short running multiple accounts at the same time remains legal. In regards to Input Broadcasting & Input Multiplexing, this will be looked at as a bannable offense.
Meaning you will risk a permanent ban, over a two-strike policy for broadcasting commands over multiple clients.

I would just like to say well done CCP, I hope FunCom can follow up and do the same.


Darkempire

[geturmoney]

this is exactly how it needs to be handled -,-

[Traderjill]

Hoping funcom does something like this as well.

[Aiken]

I'm not.

[Freor]

Not a big fan of CCP, but gotta give them credit for this. That's exactly how the damn thing needs to be policed: you can play with as many accs as you wish, but not use automation/"Input Multiplexing" to do so. Puts players more on the same line again. Very pleased to see a well-known developer do this, hoping others (those that currently allow it) - including Funcom - follow soon! Might make AO worth playing again.

[DigitalBath]

The only two major titles I've seen policing this are Path of Exile and EVE Online. Most other titles encourage or openly state it's not against the rules to multibox, at some point.

Detecting and policing it will be the real issue if something like this came to AO, as stated by a former developer (Vhab) and a few other FC employees. In practice, it's not something they can implement for many reasons, all available through the search function of the forum. Right now it would be a bad decision anyway.. there are much more important issues to be handled.

[jorricane]

The only two major titles I've seen policing this are Path of Exile and EVE Online. Most other titles encourage or openly state it's not against the rules to multibox, at some point.

Detecting and policing it will be the real issue if something like this came to AO, as stated by a former developer (Vhab) and a few other FC employees. In practice, it's not something they can implement for many reasons, all available through the search function of the forum. Right now it would be a bad decision anyway.. there are much more important issues to be handled.

This. And the fact that without the ability to multibox, there would be a lot of "useless" accounts that many multiboxers would close. The population really isn't large enough to support any mass exodus of any kind.

[Voiran]

what is exactly wrong with multiboxing. is someone jealous because they cant afford playing multiple accounts? In pvp i somehow understand its not ok but in pvm it's not anyones business what they do.

And go read that http://forums.anarchy-online.com/sho...85#post6175485

[Anonimofied]

Multibox is ok, but using 3rd softwares to key binds the boxes to gain upper hand in pvp is lame, but this is AO survival of the lamest

[Freor]

Seems some people can't tell the difference between playing with multiple accounts (alt-tabbing, multimonitors, etc) and using automation software to control all those accs at the same time by duplicating commands. You can still play with multiple accs in EVE also, just not use unfair automation to do so. FC/AO should adapt the same rule before AO dies entirely.

Population is small yes, and it's only getting smaller when people can no longer play because of the unfair boxing. And no new people with half a brain will stay when they see what they have to do if they want to have a chance, especially in pvp.

[Voiran]

Seems some people can't tell the difference between playing with multiple accounts (alt-tabbing, multimonitors, etc) and using automation software to control all those accs at the same time by duplicating commands.

I know the difference. You can go read this post http://forums.anarchy-online.com/sho...85#post6175485 and mind your own business.

[Alternity]

what is exactly wrong with multiboxing. is someone jealous because they cant afford playing multiple accounts? In pvp i somehow understand its not ok but in pvm it's not anyones business what they do.

And go read that http://forums.anarchy-online.com/sho...85#post6175485

Macrosun's point does become quite moot at this point. CCP has figured out how to monitor network traffic to sort out input broadcasting. If one person can do it, so can others.

An more interesting aspect of CCP's current EULA change is why they did it. Multiboxing with input broadcasting give a certain advantage to PvP, you melt your enemy with an alpha that can not be escaped. In other parts of EVE it is harder to do, as you heavily rely on each person in your gang knowing what to do, and can react to their role using intuition and experience. I'll just leave the PvP part of the discussion by saying that EVE Online's PvP is tenfolds better developed than AO's.
But there is no doubt in the matter that CCP went ahead with this change in order to save PvM. EVE has suffered a massive inflation driving PLEX prices up to 1bil per PLEX (PLEX = GRACE, AO nicked it from EVE :P) Single players running vast mining, industry, ratting operations were able to bend the economic market to a degree where it simply became overwhelming.

So in that regard CCP took the lesser known route out of the problem. EVE is working very hard to maintain player retention after they have finished their trial. No player wants to sit there with the impression that he needs to use 3rd party software, and multiple accounts in order to be competitive. Players can still run 6 accounts and mine the crap out of astroids by alt tabbing, if they want to. They simply can't run 24 clients at once, using 1 keyboard stroke to control all 24 accounts.
Will CCP lose short term income? Yes they will. But they did it to save the game.

Got nothing but respect for CCP.

[Freor]

EVE is working very hard to maintain player retention after they have finished their trial. No player wants to sit there with the impression that he needs to use 3rd party software, and multiple accounts in order to be competitive. Players can still run 6 accounts and mine the crap out of astroids by alt tabbing, if they want to. They simply can't run 24 clients at once, using 1 keyboard stroke to control all 24 accounts.
Will CCP lose short term income? Yes they will. But they did it to save the game.

This. A thousand times this.

I honestly cannot understand how some people posting here still cannot understand the situation. AO lost ~25% of its population after boxing killed pvp. Those who left were for the most part veteran players, many with multiple accounts. Dev(s) are still working on the NPE hoping to bring new players into AO. Here's the question: if boxing stays untouched, how are you seriously expecting those new players to stay when they see what is required to be competitive? Would YOU join a MMO that required you to install 3rd party multicontrol software and get 5-6 accs?

[Voiran]

This. A thousand times this.

I honestly cannot understand how some people posting here still cannot understand the situation. AO lost ~25% of its population after boxing killed pvp. Those who left were for the most part veteran players, many with multiple accounts. Dev(s) are still working on the NPE hoping to bring new players into AO. Here's the question: if boxing stays untouched, how are you seriously expecting those new players to stay when they see what is required to be competitive? Would YOU join a MMO that required you to install 3rd party multicontrol software and get 5-6 accs?

You most likely dont have any actual proof that 25% of population left after multiboxing was allowed. For example Armus is still playing. And you can be competitive without doing multibloxing. And ccp guys most likely won't tell other companies any detail about their systems for network traffic stuff atleast not for free.

[DigitalBath]

Not only there's nothing palpable that suggests or confirms multiboxing has anything to do with any population issue in AO as the population has been on a steady decline according to people who actually have the information (Nusquam, iirc). 25% loss due to more widespread use of MB in pvp is a lie as it'd imply an unsteady recent decline. This doesn't make it good or fair, but you don't strengthen your points with lies..

On Macrosun's point being moot.. says who? His point and FC's stance on Multiboxing are what matter here. And they're not likely to change for better or worse because, as I've mentioned, there's far more important things to fix/do.

I still stand by what I've said. The problems with multiboxing are a consequence of low population, not the other way around. We should be figuring out ways of making the game better overall in content, leveling and general feel to attract more people, new and revisiting, to the game.

You don't need to multibox to be successful in this game or even "to compete". I do PvM with 3 other people (two of which recently returned to the game) regularly and we do everything except s42 with relative ease these days while having a laugh. The game can still be very fun.
As for PvP.. I've yet to have any issues with multiboxers in 220 BS (and I doubt I will anytime soon). I don't currently engage in towers but I've seen quite the clan rush a few days ago and multiboxing seemed to not be at the center of it. Correct me if I'm wrong.

[Tryptophy]

Macrosun's point does become quite moot at this point. CCP has figured out how to monitor network traffic to sort out input broadcasting. If one person can do it, so can others.

Well to be fair CCP has a lot more resources in terms of manpower and ability to develop tools for detecting this. Unless CCP wants to open source their method and FC wants to hire more GMs to sort out the bans. Not saying I agree with MBing but I've accepted it as c'est la vie.

[Neista]

I know the difference. You can go read this post http://forums.anarchy-online.com/sho...85#post6175485 and mind your own business.

Wow, doesn't someone have a vastly inflated sense of their own importance?

[DigitalBath]

Wow, doesn't someone have a vastly inflated sense of their own importance?

Nothing about that post showed that lol..
You may need to read it again as the provided link is VERY important. Would be nice if someone with more search-fu than I have could also dig up links for Vhab's posts on the subject too. It's information both sides of the whole MB argument should take very seriously before making any statements.
Macrosun at the time of that post was the Lead Programmer of the game. Take his word for what it's worth.. and that's quite a bit.

[Voiran]

Nothing about that post showed that lol..
You may need to read it again as the provided link is VERY important. Would be nice if someone with more search-fu than I have could also dig up links for Vhab's posts on the subject too. .

found one from genele http://forums.anarchy-online.com/sho...=1#post6175540

Vhab http://forums.anarchy-online.com/sho...=1#post6175661

another one http://forums.anarchy-online.com/sho...=1#post6175671

one more http://forums.anarchy-online.com/sho...=1#post6177530

and final one for now http://forums.anarchy-online.com/sho...=1#post6177614

[Freor]

You most likely dont have any actual proof that 25% of population left after multiboxing was allowed.

AO's average population since merge (1). After initial activity spike numbers hold steady for half a year. First decline (2) was clan-only (blue line), as a result of boxing first making its way into pvp in August-September 2013. Then there was actually a population jump as FC announced the engine beta. Saw many old faces return. That lasted roughly untill things really got out of hand in pvp (4) around February-March iirc: first the 5 220 NTs, then this plague spreading into tl5 (5 crats) and tl4 (5 agents) as well. Numbers are now around 25% lower than they were before boxing first started.

And you can be competitive without doing multibloxing.

No, you cannot. There is nothing you can do to win against multiboxed 5-6 toon personal army. You might be able to meep if you get really lucky, but winning the fight, no-go. Often you cannot even get to the base before it dies. Same goes for pvm now that it's spreading there too: you simply cannot outdamage 6 multiboxed toons no matter how much you twink.

You can ofc say "bring friends", but that's not a way to balance things. What's the point in profession rebalance for example if at the same time we allow individuals to run around with a team of multiboxed toons?

And ccp guys most likely won't tell other companies any detail about their systems for network traffic stuff atleast not for free.

Very much possible. But CCP has far bigger playerbase to handle too. In AO there's only a handful of people boxing, at least in pvp. They could easily just rely on player reports alone and check if the reported toons get their commands at the same time repeatedly. That cannot be masked with different IPs etc: only their actions in-game matter.

- - -

@DigitalBath: If you dont do towers, then I'm sorry, but you really do not understand how serious the situation is.