New Engine Release should come with new blank slate server

[Baby]

It would be like playing AO for the first time, again.

Not even close. It's just you being broke with no equipment, but still the same game you know everything about already.

____

The whole idea of the new server going to be the perfect pink bubble world, is completely silly. I understand that the economy on Live is broken and that people are annoyed, but only a 3yr old kid would be naïve enough to believe no one is going to exploit, duplicate, MB or whatever on the new server. It's only a matter of time until we have the same problems on both.
You want to help new players? Do it on this server. It works the same.
Want a fresh start? Roll a new toon and go without all your twinking stuff. Maybe even join another faction.

I think a new server would rip Orgs/Friends apart and will only result in more people quitting the game.

Your argument that it's easier or make a name for themselves is why people are motivated to play. Why would you not that? It makes no sense unless you are concerned about competing.

We can turn that argument around pretty easily: Maybe you're not able to compete on this server, thus you want a new one, where you can be the first cool kid.

[AlmightyZeus]

Not even close. It's just you being broke with no equipment,

This seems to be the crux of your issue. Then don't make a toon on the new server. Stay on the old one with your pile of phat lootz.

but still the same game you know everything about already.

Is it going to be the same game? Have you been on test?

I understand that the economy on Live is broken and that people are annoyed, but ....

But what? Some people exploiting is gonna turn the economy back into what 13 years of people collecting has done? Do you really believe that or are you flaming because you simply are bored and don't feel you can contribute anything worth while?

...only a 3yr old kid would be naïve enough to believe no one is going to exploit, duplicate, MB or whatever on the new server.

Baby is an appropriate name for you if you think that ad hominem (insulting people) makes a case for you.

First off, show me exactly where I said anything about exploiting or duping?

It's only a matter of time until we have the same problems on both.

You want to help new players? Do it on this server. It works the same.

No, it won't work the same. For instance, a explosif's pillow in 2009 used to sell for 150 million. Now they sell for 1/2 billion. That change took 6 years, not 1.

Want a fresh start? Roll a new toon and go without all your twinking stuff. Maybe even join another faction.

If I wanted a new toon, I would roll a new toon. I'm asking for a fresh economy and presuming that a wipe of the current server is not an option. Next best option, new server.

I think a new server would rip Orgs/Friends apart and will only result in more people quitting the game.

I disagree. I've played enough online games with server merges and moves to know that this is a bull**** argument. Orgs move or merge. I would also love to know how many orgs are on the server made up of nothing but one persons alts. Perhaps that's your concern?

We can turn that argument around pretty easily: Maybe you're not able to compete on this server, thus you want a new one, where you can be the first cool kid.

Or, maybe I'm not stuck thinking of only myself and considering what it would be like coming into a game that is sold as new, but in actuality has a 13 year old economy.

Let's face it. A lot of people are going to be turned off by discovering this game and having to fold into existing orgs or work up to existing prices instead of being able to influence their own world/server.

[Raggy]

stuff

So explain this to me. When people go to this new server and you effectively split the population straight down the middle, what happens when all the newcomers leave the game because it's not what they thought it would be?

We go back to the horrible RK1/2 situation again and then we have another merge and then everyone from the 'new' server is back to square one with sod all credits in an economy already well established.

[AlmightyZeus]

So explain this to me. When people go to this new server and you effectively split the population straight down the middle, what happens when all the newcomers leave the game because it's not what they thought it would be?

Such a cynical view. 50% attrition rate or 50% split? What happens when they leave the game on the current server, which I think they are more inclined to do because of how hard it will be for them to compete in the economy if there is only one option.

I understand what you are saying, but I'm leery that the game will have that kind of loss. You're talking about a larger market, on a platform (steam) that can reach a lot of new members in a market that is pretty much sci-fi starved. What other mmo options do they have, EVE? In 35 years of gaming, I can honestly say that EVE was the only game I ever actually fell asleep playing.

I think if they do it right, AO could be huge and set up success in AO2. As long as they correctly capture what made AO so interesting to play.

We go back to the horrible RK1/2 situation again and then we have another merge and then everyone from the 'new' server is back to square one with sod all credits in an economy already well established.

It took 11 years before the servers merged. In 2008 both servers still had a pretty large base on both, in 2012 that base declined.

There are tons of people waiting for that engine to come out. Some that haven't played since 08 or 12. They are waiting to come back and experience the game from the beginning, not some toon they made 6 years ago.

You are also forgetting other horrible situations, like twinked 220s clearing out newb areas for their buddies while newbies can only sit there and watch. If you think that won't drive away new people, nothing will.

[Baby]

Wow, you're really angry aren't you Almighty? I wasn't flaming at anyone, or calling anyone a 3yr old kid. You only read what you want to read. And especially how you want to read it. And in reality, you're the one who was directly insulting.

Maybe you should stop ripping my post in pieces, then you would understand why I mentioned MB in the same sentence as economy. And maybe if you read my post a little more carefully, you would have noticed that I put a line under my reply to your quote. That is supposed to mean the following is not addressed at you personally, but a general statement as to how I see it. And I stick to it. A new server from scratch is a bad idea.

[lufa1982]

No thanks.

Simply put, there are better games out there, and anybody who claims otherwise, hasn't stick out his head outside Rubi-Ka for last ten years. Most of those games are also hell of a lot cheaper too, because AO happens to be the most expensive MMO on the market. The only reason everyone eventually comes back to this game, is the amount of knowledge, characters and stuff we've accumulated.

[McKnuckleSamwich]

I don't think the economy on live is screwed anymore at all.

Prices have come down on almost all the important stuff. Things that have a finite accumulation rate (SL dyna phatz) have remained relatively constant - as would be expected.

[Krause]

There are tons of people waiting for that engine to come out. Some that haven't played since 08 or 12. They are waiting to come back and experience the game from the beginning, not some toon they made 6 years ago.

What are you crazy? Of course they do, those characters have all their old memories associated with them. You must really want a new server for personal reasons to be pushing this hard for it.

The absoloute last thing this game needs is for the dev team to take a flying dump on long time players by splitting the population, and in a way where all new blood will be going to a different server.

[DigitalBath]

A new server is a bad idea on many fronts as explained by several people in this thread. It would create a new economy that can be as great or as broken as they come (no guarantee either way). It may (and likely would) create a split in the population as some people would want to stay on the old server while others may prefer the new.
I get the feeling associated with this, but in reality.. it's just not the way to go.

FC should only make a new server if/when the population grows so much that they NEED it (and revenue goes up enough that they can afford it, ofc). Otherwise, 1 server to concentrate the population in one place and make it so there are more chances for teaming up out of sheer numbers.

TL;DR - Just showing my total lack of support for this idea in case FC checks this thread to gauge how the population feels about it.

[Gargle]

Almighty, unfortunately I don't believe it comes down to anything else but population growth.

Although it was fun seeing all these irrational and nonfactual arguments against a new server from veteran players. It was like accidentally switching to Fox News.

[Krause]

Almighty, unfortunately I don't believe it comes down to anything else but population growth.

Although it was fun seeing all these irrational and nonfactual arguments against a new server from veteran players. It was like accidentally switching to Fox News.

There was more irrational and nonfactual information in your post right here than in any of the responses.

The game needs more people, the new engine/steam would give that and people have been holding out for that hope. Adding a new server with it will rob the old one of that.

I would be interested in seeing how many old vets who want a new server would still want it if multiboxing was crushed before the launch. After all it wouldn't make sense creating a new server for a fresh economy yet still leaving in one of the biggest economy nukers.

[Gargle]

There was more irrational and nonfactual information in your post right here than in any of the responses.

The game needs more people, the new engine/steam would give that and people have been holding out for that hope. Adding a new server with it will rob the old one of that.

I would be interested in seeing how many old vets who want a new server would still want it if multiboxing was crushed before the launch. After all it wouldn't make sense creating a new server for a fresh economy yet still leaving in one of the biggest economy nukers.

Great arguments still irrational and nonfactual.

[Gargle]

TL;DR: I Gargle, therefore I am.

If Funcom had any b**** they would get creative. There are a thousand ways you could improve the new player experience while adjusting and monitoring the game for a re-launch.

Just to pull a completely random example out of my *** you could for instance fire up Rimor and call it the "Community Experiment Server (CES)" (terrible name but anyway) when relaunching the game. This would be at the bottom of the list and a not recommended server if the veterans are fearing re-starts and their precious items and time invested.

The Community Experiment Server would be heavily monitored and have a disclaimer as you sign in simply stating:

- Your character may be transferred at any time to the main server should the CES be cancelled.
- All current levels are locked to level 60.
- We are continually monitoring the CES.
- We're monitoring for server congestion.
- We're monitoring the virtual economy.
- We're fixing any bugs and/or exploits.
- We're monitoring the rebalance based on your title level.
- Next level unlock will be level 100 and commence preliminarily in X weeks, months or depending on monitoring.

Now don't you think people would have a blast on CES as long as it's monitored? People would get up to all sorts of RPing, twinking, and taking on stuff that they would normally not by just out-leveling it.

People wouldn't race to level 220 because they were level locked and they could help out teaching people the game instead of every newbie that subscribed end up getting greedy and sitting at kite hill as soon as someone wrote a guide about how to level fast on Steam.

This is just one out of a thousand scenarios you could create instead of having the ignot, dupe bug, kite hill to inferno and s10 bounty legacy with you, you could monitor a server and people would have a blast pvp-ing, pvming, exploring, RPing and helping each other at every title level and people would actual find a team and not see the newbies they started with at 220 2 weeks later while they're still in TotW.

Even remove multiboxing helpers on the CES servers to see what happens if people can't multibox without actually using hooks and reading the memory of the AO client (which will get them banned).

Or scrap this and do something completely different, but do something.

[AlmightyZeus]

What are you crazy? Of course they do, those characters have all their old memories associated with them. You must really want a new server for personal reasons to be pushing this hard for it.

I'm supporting my position on the matter. I am of the firm belief that new server would gain a lot of attention, just like you do.

Sounds to me like you fully understand that "new blood" would go to the new server. Why would it if the existing server is beneficial? If everyone leaves after an initial push, what changes? The old server is still just as dead.

So what happens if the reverse is true, that we lose people not because they don't like the game, but they lose interest because they are coming into a game that will put them at a disadvantage to other players with established high level friends.

Sure, this may happen on the new server, but at least they would have a fighting change to keep up. Leaving it the way it is now, ensures there is no chance.

The absoloute last thing this game needs is for the dev team to take a flying dump on long time players by splitting the population, and in a way where all new blood will be going to a different server.

You are suggesting a split as a forgone conclusion. That's merely opinion on your part, and one that really isn't based on any kind of historical information. As I stated before, it took 11 years before the need for a server merge occurred.

In my opinion, they cannot afford to not provide a new server. If I walked into a game that I never heard of which just had a grand reopening, and then found myself on a server filled with people that had a 13 year accumulation of wealth. I don't think I would stick around very long and I'm fairly certain you probably wouldn't either.

Now if I got to feel like I was part of the building of the community, which as everyone here has had the benefit of doing, I would be more inclined to stick around, as everyone here has done.

All said, I don't think you make a convincing argument that the game would suffer because they created a new server. I think your primary concern is that not too many people will want to be a have not of a server full of haves.

[AlmightyZeus]

TL;DR: I Gargle, therefore I am.

If Funcom had any b**** they would get creative. There are a thousand ways you could improve the new player experience while adjusting and monitoring the game for a re-launch.

Just to pull a completely random example out of my *** you could for instance fire up Rimor and call it the "Community Experiment Server (CES)" (terrible name but anyway) when relaunching the game. This would be at the bottom of the list and a not recommended server if the veterans are fearing re-starts and their precious items and time invested.

The Community Experiment Server would be heavily monitored and have a disclaimer as you sign in simply stating:

- Your character may be transferred at any time to the main server should the CES be cancelled.
- All current levels are locked to level 60.
- We are continually monitoring the CES.
- We're monitoring for server congestion.
- We're monitoring the virtual economy.
- We're fixing any bugs and/or exploits.
- We're monitoring the rebalance based on your title level.
- Next level unlock will be level 100 and commence preliminarily in X weeks, months or depending on monitoring.

Now don't you think people would have a blast on CES as long as it's monitored? People would get up to all sorts of RPing, twinking, and taking on stuff that they would normally not by just out-leveling it.

People wouldn't race to level 220 because they were level locked and they could help out teaching people the game instead of every newbie that subscribed end up getting greedy and sitting at kite hill as soon as someone wrote a guide about how to level fast on Steam.

This is just one out of a thousand scenarios you could create instead of having the ignot, dupe bug, kite hill to inferno and s10 bounty legacy with you, you could monitor a server and people would have a blast pvp-ing, pvming, exploring, RPing and helping each other at every title level and people would actual find a team and not see the newbies they started with at 220 2 weeks later while they're still in TotW.

Even remove multiboxing helpers on the CES servers to see what happens if people can't multibox without actually using hooks and reading the memory of the AO client (which will get them banned).

Or scrap this and do something completely different, but do something.

I think this is a great suggestion.

Even race leagues on how fast you can get to 220.

Or CTF leagues where neuter, omni, or clan gains the most towers by a set period of time and then a reset.

[AlmightyZeus]

There was more irrational and nonfactual information in your post right here than in any of the responses.

The game needs more people, the new engine/steam would give that and people have been holding out for that hope. Adding a new server with it will rob the old one of that.

I would be interested in seeing how many old vets who want a new server would still want it if multiboxing was crushed before the launch. After all it wouldn't make sense creating a new server for a fresh economy yet still leaving in one of the biggest economy nukers.

It will rob the old one... yeah and so what? Are you concerned what's best for the games longevity or for you personally?

I think there will be plenty of room for both servers, but yes, a new server will get the lions share of people and we both know why. That fact just reinforces my argument for it.

[Raggy]

It will rob the old one... yeah and so what? Are you concerned what's best for the games longevity or for you personally?

I think there will be plenty of room for both servers, but yes, a new server will get the lions share of people and we both know why. That fact just reinforces my argument for it.

You seem to be of the mind that the economy in AO is exclusive, when actually it's the entire opposite. New players would have no issue adjusting to the prices by simply asking how to make money. There are a myriad of ways to make money in AO, a significant portion of them are froob.

Concrete Cushions
Basic Armour Sets
Buff Weapons
RK Dyna Loot
RK Dyna Nanos
Carbonum Sets
Blitzing

And if they take the plunge into SL, they have:

Arul Saba building
1000001 SL Dyna camps
Symbs/PB Farming
Kiting
OSTing (if they get high enough)


Face it, the only thing these people need is knowledge, which will come in time while they play, a new server won't do anything to help that because nobody will have credits for the basic things needed to progress.

Oh and I would actually pay good money to watch a bunch of people actually try and do the Ado Brain at the appropriate level with no 220 help.

[AlmightyZeus]

Oh and I would actually pay good money to watch a bunch of people actually try and do the Ado Brain at the appropriate level with no 220 help.

You bring up a good point and a cool idea. Record and list server firsts. Wouldn't you want to have the bragging rights on being the first one to do it?

[Caloss2]

So, the scenario is new server, that can be populated by old players;
Who pretty much know every useful item in the game, and where to get it from, and exactly what way to build a toon/s to get them ?

Would that not result in an elite group of players/guild controlling the games economy and raiding and land control ?

Oh and I would actually pay good money to watch a bunch of people actually try and do the Ado Brain at the appropriate level with no 220 help.

Well sorry, I didn't fraps that for you, but it does actually happen. Not often I grant you.

As for 220's on this hypothetical "new server", granted it would take around a month for the first ones to appear; and monopolize the game, so infact what you are hoping to castrate from the game, would actually flourish on a new server, that old players can use.

[AlmightyZeus]

So, the scenario is new server, that can be populated by old players;
Who pretty much know every useful item in the game, and where to get it from, and exactly what way to build a toon/s to get them ?

Would that not result in an elite group of players/guild controlling the games economy and raiding and land control ?

As I stated before, this could happen, but allows for opportunity for new players to get involved. There is enough information out on the web that new players could orient themselves to getting what they need or how to go about raiding and do land control.

It's a matter of some chance vs no chance. As it stands now, they would have to hope someone gets bored and leaves.

As for 220's on this hypothetical "new server", granted it would take around a month for the first ones to appear; and monopolize the game, so infact what you are hoping to castrate from the game, would actually flourish on a new server, that old players can use.

What are you basing this month from? If that's how long it takes now, consider that you won't have any 220s to run you through stuff like you do now, no market filled with 300 ql things you need, no mochs a plenty or twinked out traders.

I submit it will take a bit longer than that.