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Thread: 18.7 official patch notes

  1. #1

    18.7 official patch notes

    So now they're up and all official, I have to ask. WTactualF happened to CH? 40 second lockout? FORTY?

    Can someone please explain how this is in any way not going to wreck doc functioning between the time they hit about TL5 and the time they get their DB Nanos? Or should I just retire my Froob, Sloob and midlevel docs right now?

    Ophiuchus : 220/30/80 HAHA etc
    Nahuatl
    :: 220/30/80 Melee 4lyfe
    Khurkh :: 220/30/80 healtankpew
    Transcendence
    Msanthropic
    : 210/26/60 nanostab
    Spidershiva :: 165/23/42 kite? eh?
    Silentmotion
    : 150/20/42 tankthink
    The Union

  2. #2
    Lower heals heal a lot better, also mentioned in the patchnotes.
    Don't you just hate this kind of ppl
    http://redwing.hutman.net/%7Emreed/w...rouscranus.htm

  3. #3
    Doctor Single target healing Lifegiving Elixir now heals the target 2100 to 2520 and that it locks the Single Target Healing for 4.00 seconds with a recharge of 2 seconds.
    Doctor Single target healing Recuperative Respite now heals the target 1900 to 2280 and that it locks the Single Target Healing for 4.00 seconds with a recharge of 2 seconds.
    Doctor Single target healing Emergency Medical Response now heals the target 1700 to 2040 and that it locks the Single Target Healing for 4.00 seconds with a recharge of 2 seconds.

    With these changes tl5 docs shouldn't have a need to cast CH. The only place it would be useful would be on ado hecks, which is actually an improvement, since with the loss of SL aggro on CH you won't die after casting it. (pvm only ofc, cry all you want about pvp use of CH)
    Why play melee when crat pets can do your job?
    Quote Originally Posted by Wyldebeast View Post
    Simple, why the melee hate?
    Quote Originally Posted by Means View Post
    ...Melee people/pets are needed...

  4. #4
    The lockout on the iCH nano's was always waaay too short imo. This seems much more appropriate now.
    One profession to RoO them all, one profession to proc stun them, one profession to calm them all and in the darkness Exp perk them!

    Crataiken 220/30/70 General - Primal Evolution - 3rd AI 30 'Crat on RK 1 Setup
    Calms 220/30/70 General - Primal Evolution
    Medicaiken 220/30/70 General - Primal Evolution Setup
    Newen 220/30/70 President - The Galactic Milieu
    Mettagirl 220/20/** General - Primal Evolution
    Krataiken 150/18/40 General - Primal Evolution Setup

  5. #5
    I think the 20 second ICH/40 second CH line cool downs might be left over from 18.7.0.17 patch notes. As of the latest TL patch, it's 15 ICH/30 CH.

  6. #6
    I'm not even talking about iCH.

    I'm talking about before that, before you get DB nanos at TL7. I'm talking about when you've already been using LE for the last 50+ levels and the first SL heal isn't even castable yet due to the level lock. Not that those first couple of SL heals are worth much anyway, and I didn't see anything about them being adjusted in these patch notes. It's that level range from 150-215 that I'm talking about.

    Ophiuchus : 220/30/80 HAHA etc
    Nahuatl
    :: 220/30/80 Melee 4lyfe
    Khurkh :: 220/30/80 healtankpew
    Transcendence
    Msanthropic
    : 210/26/60 nanostab
    Spidershiva :: 165/23/42 kite? eh?
    Silentmotion
    : 150/20/42 tankthink
    The Union

  7. #7
    Ophiuchus has valid point. Since both (I)CH are healing target completely, should just revised the cool down to CH=20s, ICH=40s to benefit to lower TL doctors.

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Transform View Post
    Ophiuchus has valid point. Since both (I)CH are healing target completely, should just revised the cool down to CH=20s, ICH=40s to benefit to lower TL doctors.
    I see where you're coming from, but why would the higher level version even need to exist then?

    There would be no reason to use ICH, which has nearly 3 times the nanoskill requirement, if it locked the Complete Healing nanoline for longer.
    Vinkera - Soli NT - 426k DPM - Setup
    Robbey - Soli Crat

    Lone anarchists - Tower of Babil

    Celez - Soli Doc
    Loaloa - Soli Enf
    Wondershot - Nano Soldier
    Robzor - Soli Engi
    Proserpexa - Opi Agent

    Trying out civilization - Storm

  9. #9
    ICH exist so TL7 doctor can handle "Oh sh*t"" moment twice in 20 seconds...

  10. #10
    Exactly what situations do tl5-6 docs get into where healing is needed and the improved RK single heals combined with the 40 sec CH doesn't cut it? The only area I recall having difficulties with back when I leveled my doc was ado hecks and pen mishes, and the improvement to the top RK single heals more than fill that void. Are we talking froob CH chains or some oddball situation like that?
    Why play melee when crat pets can do your job?
    Quote Originally Posted by Wyldebeast View Post
    Simple, why the melee hate?
    Quote Originally Posted by Means View Post
    ...Melee people/pets are needed...

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Transform View Post
    ICH exist so TL7 doctor can handle "Oh sh*t"" moment twice in 20 seconds...
    My point is, using one locks the other. That is the purpose of a "line" cooldown as opposed to a single nano's recharge. Line cooldowns free you up to cast other nanos, but not in the same line for as long as the nano you cast locks the line for.

    The point of ICH is the line cooldown is much shorter than CH, but at the cost of high nanoskills and level to use it, obviously. CH is 30 seconds, not 40. That must have been an error on Michi's part. ICH is also castable quicker now than on currently on Live at 15 seconds. However, like I said, using one locks the other, so if i were able to cast ICH, but I hit CH by mistake, I cannot use ICH for 30 seconds, instead of its usual 15.

    Nanos in the "Complete Healing" nanoline are listed here: http://tl.aoitems.com/nano/strain/282/

    I'd like to also address the OP and anyone reading this concerned. These changes, on paper, look awful, but mechanically they work vastly better. The concept of "line cooldown" is new to most, but the point is to free up nano casting professions from long recharges on nanos, but prevent the ability to spam. So now, as a TL 5 doctor, you can cast CH and then LE *2 seconds later*. You are no longer waiting a grueling 8 seconds to be able to cast anything else. With LE being stronger, you actually have more healing power, more quickly. LE itself has been given a line cooldown, so you now also have the opportunity to put refreshing a DoT into your rotation of casts.

    Overall these changes add up to be pretty awesome for a TL5/6 doc. Don't knock it until you try it.
    Last edited by Vinkera; Apr 20th, 2015 at 12:10:06.
    Vinkera - Soli NT - 426k DPM - Setup
    Robbey - Soli Crat

    Lone anarchists - Tower of Babil

    Celez - Soli Doc
    Loaloa - Soli Enf
    Wondershot - Nano Soldier
    Robzor - Soli Engi
    Proserpexa - Opi Agent

    Trying out civilization - Storm

  12. #12
    If this is "line" cool down, then we are screwed.

    All the while I understand is both CH have "self" lock down. Else, it serves no purposely to get ICH.

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Transform View Post
    If this is "line" cool down, then we are screwed.

    All the while I understand is both CH have "self" lock down. Else, it serves no purposely to get ICH.
    iCH cooldown is 15s, unlike CH cooldown which is 30s. That's the reason to get iCH, you can cast it more often.

    220s "Wakizaka", "Sneakygank", "Wakimango", "Wakisolja", "Tardersauce", "Bushwaki", "Midgetgank", "Bugfixxx", "Ramsbottom", "Paskadoc"
    200s Chrisd, Malema, Delbaeth
    TL5s Youfail, Bugfixx, Riothamus, Johndee

    Proud President of Haven | TL5 PvP


  14. #14

  15. #15
    And another thing: nanoinits have been removed from midlevel docs (Scheol Nanos). Highlevel docs are getting it all back and then some but why the nerf to midlevel doc inits?

    And the 65 Healdelta buff now uses nearly double NCU according to the aoitems testlive rip?

    Did sub-TL7 docs kick Funcom's puppy or something?

    Ophiuchus : 220/30/80 HAHA etc
    Nahuatl
    :: 220/30/80 Melee 4lyfe
    Khurkh :: 220/30/80 healtankpew
    Transcendence
    Msanthropic
    : 210/26/60 nanostab
    Spidershiva :: 165/23/42 kite? eh?
    Silentmotion
    : 150/20/42 tankthink
    The Union

  16. #16
    Ophiuchus,
    Forget about it! I don't want to flame those so-called-professional but I personally felt that 18.7 was meant to pleased the level 215+ players.

    If you never pvp on TL4/5 doctor. Let me tell you that even 30 seconds lock down on CH will screw them.

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Transform View Post
    Ophiuchus,
    Forget about it! I don't want to flame those so-called-professional but I personally felt that 18.7 was meant to pleased the level 215+ players.

    If you never pvp on TL4/5 doctor. Let me tell you that even 30 seconds lock down on CH will screw them.
    I don't even understand this.

    If you PVP on a TL4/5 doc, the change to LGE is like a godsend. Healing for 2-3k every 4 seconds, but spammable with team heals will make you incredibly valuable. The obvious change is that it only requires a minor adjustment in behaviour:

    18.6: You wait till the enf has 10% HP remaining and pop a CH
    18.7: you pop LGE when the enf is at 80% HP and again when he's at 70% HP and again when he's at 60% HP, and again when he's at 40% HP and then you pop CH and you keep healing him this way.

    If the other side hasn't retargeted you by that point, and you haven't killed them, I don't think the problem is healing, it's lack of team mates.

  18. #18
    McknuckleSamwich,
    Agreed with your. But from PVP point of view. new LGE are benefit more to TL5 agent with FP doctor rather more than TL5 doctor. Any change to healing mechanism in game should gives more benefits to doctor first. I'm just not happy with this change.

    Not to mention about mass pvp, very often you need to pop CH as soon as the nano recharged. I don't have much concerns with PvM anyway. PvM in AO are easy enough.

    Also, most of 18.7 contents are focused on TL7 instead of TL3/4/5. I do not participate test live so I will not comment until 18.7 hits live and see what's the other impacts to mid level pvp player.

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by Transform View Post
    Ophiuchus,
    Forget about it! I don't want to flame those so-called-professional but I personally felt that 18.7 was meant to pleased the level 215+ players.
    That's a pretty disrespectful and ignorant comment. We've only been testing 18.7 for about 8 months, what do we know?
    Vinkera - Soli NT - 426k DPM - Setup
    Robbey - Soli Crat

    Lone anarchists - Tower of Babil

    Celez - Soli Doc
    Loaloa - Soli Enf
    Wondershot - Nano Soldier
    Robzor - Soli Engi
    Proserpexa - Opi Agent

    Trying out civilization - Storm

  20. #20
    well I was talking about PVP.

    in PVm who cares as you rightly said.

    In PVP the only prof who might come close to being able to get 10k HP is enf (my 85 enf had 8.4k with OSB I think)

    I really don't see the issue on this, and I think it's short sighted not to look for the value instead of just assuming it's not as good since it's "different".

    The reality is, a 2.5k heal on a 4s CD will be a MASSIVE boost for docs keeping more than one toon alive in PVP.

    The obvious is always true and always applicable: defence, a timely heal, and tanking the zerg for 5-10s more than the opposing side can tank your zerg always equates to an advantage for the side that can keep the zergs target alive longer.

    That means you can do 2 2.5k heals and a team heal for 3k heals on 2 called targets instead of 1 CH which is way overkill because GOOD targets in PVP almost exclusively don't have high HP. Who do you call first? Enforcer or crat? soldier or engi? keeper or trader?

    My 110 MP has just under 1600 HP and trust me, I'd rather get 2x 2.5k heals spaced 4s apart than 1 10.5k heal and my buddy dies 5 seconds later because doc couldn't get a heal off.

    the problem with CH, and this has always been the case, is that you have to endure colossal overheal from Tl3 thru to late TL5. It's a rare day when CH is used to capacity imo - I mean, lets think about it for a moment.

    My 85 enf is twinked with 141 CM and is maxed out, and even then with OSB and mongo, he's only got 8.4k HP - in this case, it serves the doctor far more to be popping lower heals because quite frankly, a good enf at Tl3 should be able to handle a crap tonne of aggro via absorbs in PVM, and in PVP, anyone who targets that toon before a doctor isn't considered a threat anyway I'd say.

    Lets move to mid TL4: a 126 enf with full maxed gear with 203 set of CM, SOW/axe or SOW/CC will likely have about 11.5-12.5k HP here, if the enf is twinked to hell CH might start seeing full usage with no wasteage, but honestly, you're far better off popping a few small heals to keep UP the hp than let the enf go so low. The reason is because people generally start popping unnecessary defences when HP drops that low. In PVM a stray crit can knock em out, in PVP a lucky AS can finish them - and a high multiplier AS can roast an enf right thru a coon defence in a worst case scenario.

    At TL5 most levelling toons are lucky to get 6-7k HP doing ado hecks or whatever, you're far better off to be maintaining HP than waiting for your tank to be 1 hit away from reclaim. But in PVP, again, it's a different story, in TL5 HP ranges are a bit different, here we start seeing some more serious HP, my 170 keeper has nearly 16k HP with OSB's and with a swap or two in and perks in crusade. Enfs probably can get 17k. soldiers probably are between 10k and 13.5k depending on setup, but then there's the lower/mid HP range, a proper setup trader/crat/fixer/MP might only have 5k-7 with OSB, engi might try for more, MA maybe 7-8k dep on setup and whether or not he's goin for a low HP setup, agent, not sure but prob can get around 11-13k with a max HP/doc setup/enf setup.

    So at TL5 here we gunna see some different style of healing becoming more important I guess. doc goin to have to be proactive healers as opposed to reactive healers. There will probably be more emphasis on team HoT's and maintaining health than big CH's in the nick of time.

    But this isn't a bad thing. It just means we're going to be forced into playing more defensively. Higher defence = reduce damage taken, but it makes sense with most changes aside from the stupid advy evades adjustment.

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