Change Collector WU drop to silver box loot! And off the body as well!

[Awikun]

WU dropping from silver or gold boxes is very bad idea for 2 reasons:
1. For any level 220 looting WU from silver or gold box would be a great dissapointment as it is so easy to get it elswhere or buy lootright for 10m
2. For level 200 twink it would be a great time sink and a waste of tons of other items that he will get opening many bronze boxes and probably quite few items will have a level 201+ lock

So there are only 2 logical solutions:
1. No WU from collector at all (which is another question)
2. WU drops from collector body so any team member can relog to his lowbie twink and come to loot it.

Personally I would like to see option number 2 as it already works with other twinks lootin EoT or in my case I had level 150 MA looting Aura magnifier from collector body.

[Rockdizzle]

Awikun brings up a good but separate point that I haven't had a chance to bring up, which is how does this affect TL7s? (loot is always wasted at any level anyways)
Obviously it's not a good change for them as WUs have no value to TL7s and is the only item I can think of with a 100+% drop rate(2 WUs from 12man is common, I've seen 4 drop and heard a orgmate got one with more than 6), doesn't help that it's placed in the hardest box to get which lowers the odds for getting the other more valuable items.(Even the alien probe is more valuable, how sad)
**Forgot about AC dropping 3 matrix boxes for each type and ICE from APF gens, could include multi part items(4+ needed) but that's stretching it a bit.

Collector for all intents and purpose is a TL7 instance for getting a chance at random loot from most places(yes even IS stuff drops in Collector), lowbies getting the gear here should always come second to 201+ toons but still at least considered.

lowbie/common/social gear/junk drops from bronze chests which everyone gets at least 1 of(assuming 6 person team) which also comes with a chance of a silver chest(1/7 to 1/9 average, you don't always get a silver in a set of boxes),
Silver is where the problem is, it has a bigger loot pool(decent/nice loot in it at least) than bronze and half the chances of a gold box compared to getting a silver in bronze boxes. (1/20-1/25 minimum, the total amount of newly added loot is unknown atm but its at least 6),
Than you have Gold Chests where 10 items(used to be 9) drop putting the odds of getting what you want past 1/1000, the droprate for getting any item you want from gold chests dropped by more than 10% in just 1-2 patches and no ones really mentioned it yet.


Should it drop off his corpse instead?
Maybe, if the droprate was appropriate. I wouldn't care much myself if it did but I don't think many are keen on WUs turning into a lazy twinkers pay to win option. Would likely kill what little value WUs actually have which was 0 until it came to Collector.
I'm neutral on this as I place the value of the item in getting it on, how good it is and how my twink performs overall with it. It being hard just means I gotta waste time getting it over the time consuming process of actually getting it on.

PATA on my level 30 Enf for example has more value than on my 76 Sold since it was both more difficult to get on(can't be done any sooner) and benefits my twink more. It being hard to get would turn me off and just make me put that effort elsewhere like imps(had to wear the PATA before my final imps were finished).

Should it just be removed?
Wouldn't kill me tbh if it was, The thought of twinking a Envy on a 200 fixer hurts me a lot, 2nd hardest twink at 200 behind Adv granted peh'wer doesn't stay 100% without combat hud or towers/contracts unlike fixer that 100%s Envy selfed.
Sultry would prolly be for this with his reason of it being previously impossible to get but you could go all or nothing with that reason if you wanted, no TOTW/Foremans/IS loot/ ELLTS(not ingame besides collector) and WUs with the only loot being from instances/PFs without level locks and loot that's in game somewhere else. Obviously no one would agree with that, just throwing it out there.


My solution is to just clean up and remove the unwanted junk from bronze/silver/gold chests improving the odds of getting everything else including the WU.
I could easily make a list of 20 items from corpse and boxes that no one goes there for and 99% of the time deletes. The 1% is when I keep a bag or 2 to hold the junk I'll delete later. Removing a bunch of them would seriously decrease the amount of disappointment that results from a average luck run of 5 kills (multiple Uklesh Swords and tattoos anyone?), don't get me started on a bad luck run either.

It doesn't completely satisfy those who want WU removed for example but it helps out those who understand that the Collector loot table was made more bigger recently than needed.

*sidenote*Still haven't even seen a confirmation from anyone that WUs are even dropping in Collector at all yet, kinda makes this whole argument ridiculous for both sides. Would be laugh worthy if it stayed in Gold Chests and took 1 month+ to find out it doesn't actually drop properly(again).

[Pomidor]

Worse suffer of geting WU at 200 would have soldiers: they already can not wear Dshark (lvl req), ql 300 OFAB or Xan because FA req.

I agree with Awi post above: take away WU (if it drops at all, heh) or put it on body of Collector.

[Mulator]

what next acdc on collector body??

[Rockdizzle]

what next acdc on collector body??

Haven't heard of anyone here suggesting to move other items so I would say the answer to that is no. If you don't like the idea of moving WU to corpse than you have 4 other choices you can pick from or even make your own.

1.Reduce Collector loot in bronze/silver/gold chests
2.Remove WU entirely
3.Move WU to Silver, Adjustments can be made if needed.
4.Do nothing/leave it where it is

TBH this is the first time I've personally seen a thread where I saw more than 1 person suggest moving an item from chests directly to corpse.

[sultryvoltron]

Wouldn't Advys just use Troa'ler?

Also do people really want Advys using Troa'ler in 200 BS? Some super rough number crunching looks like they can cap AS, or get dang close.

[Pomidor]

They would probably - some weapons would require lvl lock fo sure, especially greed of xan for 201+. Maybe Troa'ler would need be locked aswell in same way.

[sultryvoltron]

They would probably - some weapons would require lvl lock fo sure, especially greed of xan for 201+. Maybe Troa'ler would need be locked aswell in same way.

If you will let some prof use Xan weapons is it fair to lock out the rest?

[Pomidor]

actually, no

[Rockdizzle]

http://auno.org/ao/equip.php?saveid=197866 (ignore the atrox genomes, should be opifex) using this setup which is pretty much the best you can make you only end up at 1787 pistol and 1307 AS (with ES graft). Gotta use a AS scope and 3 xan pistol mems to 100% a gun that will only have a 16 sec AS at best. The Craphander tho not amazing does have better use in the hands of an Advy in leet morph allowing for double the AS dmg than troaler with 150% buff.

This also ignores the fact that the gun(s) don't just pop on if you intend to use a good offhand like Twitch or Peh'wer so only the best(who will beat you regardless) will be running it.


To Pomidor: What reason were you thinking of for suggesting the greed be 201+, atm it's just a highly boosted Ofab MK 5 shotty with no AS and slower fling for pvm. Just curious

[Pomidor]

I was wrong about greed of xan - I keep forgoting it doesn't have AS.

[sultryvoltron]

http://auno.org/ao/equip.php?saveid=197866 (ignore the atrox genomes, should be opifex) using this setup which is pretty much the best you can make you only end up at 1787 pistol and 1307 AS (with ES graft). Gotta use a AS scope and 3 xan pistol mems to 100% a gun that will only have a 16 sec AS at best. The Craphander tho not amazing does have better use in the hands of an Advy in leet morph allowing for double the AS dmg than troaler with 150% buff.

This also ignores the fact that the gun(s) don't just pop on if you intend to use a good offhand like Twitch or Peh'wer so only the best(who will beat you regardless) will be running it.


To Pomidor: What reason were you thinking of for suggesting the greed be 201+, atm it's just a highly boosted Ofab MK 5 shotty with no AS and slower fling for pvm. Just curious

Again, rough calculations:
Against a target with 10k HP and this given setup a Troa'ler will cap if you get a 4+ multiplier or higher on non-crits and 3+ multiplier on crits. With that amount of AS skill you should have an 18 max multiplier, so the vast majority of your AS should cap. Also with AS scope and Ranger cloak you can get a 14s AS recharge. Over the course of 2 mins you can expect to do 27,000 AS damage with this setup and Troa'ler.

With the same 10k HP using a craphander you cannot cap damage unless you crit. Leet buff will give you a guaranteed 2 crit AS's but then you will most likely get 9 non-critting AS's which will range from 1000-2000 dmg. Absolute best case scenario where you get all perfect 18 multiplier AS's you will do around 25,000 AS damage.

This doesn't even consider the vastly superior regulars from Troa'ler due to much higher pistol AR, higher MBS, way bigger clip, higher range, and way better damage template. You also gain some really nice buffs from Troa'ler.

You're way better at damage calcs and setup theory crafting than I am, but it seems like on paper even with slower AS recharge the Troa'ler will do a little more damage with specials and way more damage with regulars.

[Rockdizzle]

Never stated it wasn't better, merely pointing out that it's not easy to pull off. If I saw a 200 troa'ler Adv the first thing I would do is Ranged Decomp them since unless they have contracts/towers it's gonna be 75%.
The mods are mostly irrelevant as you sacrifice more than you gain from the Troa'ler to 100% it. Not to mention the lack of setup freedom unless you accept a 75% troa'ler with weaker and/or slower ASs.

To test the ASs I used my Pistol Trader on test(lolsy setup I know heh) at 2288 AR , 1653 AS and 242 add dmg(I had to make a few changes to trader). If the adv runs Pred buff the difference is 10 add dmg , 10 AS and 9 AR which is barely noticable.

Tested on a 16.6k HP target to get the higher ASs for profs like Keeps/FP Enf Agents/Docs, didn't run 13% reflect so that may need considering. AS speed is 14.4 seconds, faster than the 16 I said.
Regular hits were 570, Crits at 769. at 10k HP you would need a 5x multiplier to cap(6x if 13% reflects) and 4x multiplier if crit(5x if 13% reflects)
75% oe (1781 pistol) was 453, Crits were 601. The AS tests were done at 100% only but you can just lower the ASs by 25% dmg

About half of the ASs were in the 1800-3000 range, about 10% were 2x at 1140, another 10% were 3.8k and the rest past 4k. At 9-10k HP the Troaler would indeed excel over the craphander no contest, having an Org with a AS contract and a ransacking tower only further widens the gap. Below 9k HP both guns cap enough to not matter.

Against anything with more than 12k HP tho you start to notice where each works well the best, the Troa'ler is consistent at 2-4k ASs which rapes at 9-10k but rarely hits past that without extra add dmg/crit, craphander hits sucky 1-2k ASs alot but crit ASs are always impressive. Comes down to who you fight and how you play your adv instead of being a 1-sided comparison, besides Agent/Keeper/Fixer most profs fall under the same category of how they wish to play their prof and what setup they'll use.