Hotswappin Pvp Engy

[Alceona]

I was using many weapons (I'm not playing anymore):
1) Sloth of the Xan. Awesome item, because looks great. Also good pvm dmg.
2) Remodulator. Nice debuff thing. That's all, because you have small perk dmg and don't have weapon dmg. As Takun said you should have good team for this weapon. I was using it for team pvp.
3) Superior Sapphistic Bow. Medium AS dmg if you have good crit with good add dmg, but AS is only one type of dmg that you have with it. So I was using it for fun ocasionaly (RK weapons have small requirements to equip, I have MBC with 0 IP in the bow skill. I'm not crazy to incrise bow skill for this trash).
4) Troller + other pistol is good pvp setup for noob engi, becouse it has stable AS even in poor equipment. That is only one advantage of this weapon. Troller has medium AR and didn't have critical AS. FC did everything to not allowed us use it as effective as Adv or Crat.
5) AMEP + Onehander. Good pvp setup for top equiped engi, because this setup gives you the highest AR and AS close to Troller's AS, also Onehander has good critical AS. With poor or medium equipment you don't feel advantages of this setup, because you need top crit + top AR + top add dmg setup. AMEP is a good pvm weapon also.
6) Ql 275 Ofab Tiger Mk 6 (ql 300 is possible to equip on opifex engi only with ql 300 tower spot, I was using ql 300). Good stable AS that is always 30% Hp of your enemy (cocon dies from 1 AS). For pvp this weapon as good as AMEP + Onehander, but Disadvantage is low AR and worse pvm dmg. It's hard to do 1800 AS for 11 sec recharge also, only opifex can do it without towers.

[Siro]

7) ql300 EC3

swapable with Sloth of the Xan or Combat Remod

But please explain why Troaler is more effective used by Crat instead of Engi? Adv ofc, is far away because of AS-Skill somewhere 2k+
But Crat, I dont get it why ...

[dritst]

7) ql300 EC3

swapable with Sloth of the Xan or Combat Remod

But please explain why Troaler is more effective used by Crat instead of Engi? Adv ofc, is far away because of AS-Skill somewhere 2k+
But Crat, I dont get it why ...

Maybe he was thinking about AS+nuke combo, otherwise yeap i dont get it too, engi can get more Add dmge and similar AS skill.

[Alceona]

I posted weapons that i was using. I never used KEC 3, because it's pre LE pvp config and it wasn't as effective as other since LE relise (AS dmg is the same as AS from Superior Sapphistic Bow). Acording my opinion there are 3 useable pvp setups atm:

1) Troller + other pistol

2) AMEP + onehander

3) 275 ofab Tiger MK 6

They are simmilar effective and all of them have their own pros and cons. Some professions easy то kill with Troller, some professions easy то kill with AMEP/Onehander or Tiger.

[Alceona]

Maybe he was thinking about AS+nuke combo, otherwise yeap i dont get it too, engi can get more Add dmge and similar AS skill.

Engi can't do high Perk AR with troller as Crat or Adv (2800 maximum without towers). And yes we have high add dmg, so we can do AS dmg from onehander close to Troller AS dmg.

My add dmg selfbuffed is 567.
With Onehander I have:
Minimal AS 121*3,6=436+567=1003 and minimal critical AS (121+584)*3,6=2538+567=3105
With Troller I could have:
Minimal AS 225*4,23=952+567=1519 and minimal critical AS (225+100)*4,23=1375+567=1942

So with AMEP/Onehander I lose some dmg from ordinary AS and get additional 400 points AR for AI perks and huge critical AS.

PS: Those formulas for engi only. Crat has 3,86 multiplier for Troller dmg. Adv has 4,96 multiplier.

[Siro]

PS: Those formulas for engi only. Crat has 3,86 multiplier for Troller dmg. Adv has 4,96 multiplier.

source please, would be interesting for doc, agent, soldja and more.


I am not sure what u are calcing there:

Lets take your troaler min hit:
Minimal AS 225*4,23=952+567=1519 and minimal critical AS (225+100)*4,23=1375+567=1942
/edit: as long as I can remember, I never did an AS with Troaler on Eng below 1k (ur 1,5k/2 ofc) neither with my crat and only 217 add dmg. (inclusive AC calcs, halfdmg pvp and all those stuff)
with craphander and advy yes, something about 650 hits if I can remember right (long time ago I played my adv (especially with craphander))

But why *4,23? And what is about AS multiplier? In an usual setup u should have about 1600 AS which means a *17 multiplier. So every AS would be capped or how do u care about the AS multiplier?

My last point I found somewhere in the depths of this forum is another AS formular:
[MaxHit (+crit bonus) + add dmg] * AS multiplier * a mystical funcom multiplier 1-7 = AS

[dritst]

Engi can't do high Perk AR with troller as Crat or Adv (2800 maximum without towers). And yes we have high add dmg, so we can do AS dmg from onehander close to Troller AS dmg.
So with AMEP/Onehander I lose some dmg from ordinary AS and get additional 400 points AR for AI perks and huge critical AS.

About crat/engi troller: Yes Engi will get less AR but we can focus more on add dmge than crats and bloker/hp allow us to be more safe (crat=css,ofab back // engi cc/jathos/erbp and even arul 5 gem left)
Onehander isnt bad but it has too low range (smart people kite us, our RS is one of the lowest). Or you sacrifice hud 1 to ekip Yatamutchy Movement Predictor -Xl1
But it is more about the way you enjoy pvp, all setup are good if you know how to play the profession.

What about Troller+Low Recoil Diamondine Kick Pistol with shoty perk? 4) ?

[Mostadio]

What about Troller+Low Recoil Diamondine Kick Pistol with shoty perk? 4) ?

Low AR, high special recharge. Doesn't sound fun :S

[Scvm]

PS: Those formulas for engi only. Crat has 3,86 multiplier for Troller dmg. Adv has 4,96 multiplier.

source please, would be interesting for doc, agent, soldja and more.

Alceona apparently just used 1/6, 1/12, 1/3 for post-1k engi, crat, adv AR multipliers, respectively. I can't speak to the engi numbers, but that shouldn't be too far off for crats, and advs actually have a 4.83 weapon damage multiplier at 2750 attack rating.

Carry on.

[Alceona]

Everybody can count minimal AS size, so it's easy to realise how good AS will be with new weapon.

1. If your AR = or < 1000 AR multiplier will be AR/400+1 (800/400+1=3).

2. If you AR more than 1000 AR multiplier will be (1+1000/400)+(AR-1000)/400*professional coefficient

Every weapon has Attack rating cap (troller has 2750), so if you have AR more then Attack rating cap your should use formula (1+1000/400)+(Attack rating cap - 1000)/400*professional coefficient

3. Professional coefficients:

1/2 - Agent, Mart.Artist, Shade.
1/3 - Adventurer, Enforcer, Fixer, Keeper, Soldier.
1/6 - Engineer, Meta-Phys., Trader.
1/12 - Bureaucrat, Doctor, Nano-Tech.

Engineer can do > 2750 AR so AR multiplier for Troller will be 1+1000/400+(2750-1000)/400*1/6=4,23

4. Minimal AS=max dmg*AR multiplier+add dmg

If I used Troller, It would be 225*4,23+567=1519

5. Minimal critical AS dmg=(max dmg+critical dmg)*AR multiplier+add dmg

If I used Troller, It would be (225+100)*4,23+567=1942

6. AS=minimal AS*AS multiplier. Critical AS=minimal critical AS*AS multiplier. AS multiplier depends from size of AS skill.

AS multiplier is randome part of AS it could be 0,5, 1, 1,5, 2, 2,5, 3 etr (I've made a misstake on my enfo some time ago. I was swapping supernova and didn't make AS maximal. My AS skill was less than 500 and AS multiplier was 0,5. I was really surprised becouse i thought that 1 is minimal.) I was testing AS with different sizes of AS skill from 1500 to 1800 and I can tell you that AS multiplier is random. When i was testing it with 1650 skill 80% of AS multipliers were: 1, 1,5, 2, 2,5 and 20% of it were AS cap, so i cant tell you was it hier multiplier or critical AS.

I suppose If your AS skill is less than 1000, minimal AS multiplier will be 0,5
I'm sure If your AS sill is more than 1000, minimal AS multiplier will be 1
I suppose If your AS sill is more than 2000, minimal AS multiplier will be 2 ore 1,5

Ps: Troller Adventurer AR multiplier=(1+1000/400)*(2750-1000)/400*1/3=4,96. Thous formulas works as well and you can count your minimal AS dmg to 1 point (i've checked out them on crappy AS weapons without add dmg). But may be you are right and AR multiplier formula for 2500+ AR looks a little different. It's easy to realise: hit a leet with critical hit than use this formula AR multiplier=(critical hit-add dmg)/(max dmg+critical dmg). Be sure you have 2750+ AR and don't forget to count all of your add dmg (leet has no AC so it will be real maximal crit).

[sannz]

Everybody can count minimal AS size, so it's easy to realise how good AS will be with new weapon.

1. If your AR = or < 1000 AR multiplier will be AR/400+1 (800/400+1=3).

2. If you AR more than 1000 AR multiplier will be (1+1000/400)+(AR-1000)/400*professional coefficient

Every weapon has Attack rating cap (troller has 2750), so if you have AR more then Attack rating cap your should use formula (1+1000/400)+(Attack rating cap - 1000)/400*professional coefficient

3. Professional coefficients:

1/2 - Agent, Mart.Artist, Shade.
1/3 - Adventurer, Enforcer, Fixer, Keeper, Soldier.
1/6 - Engineer, Meta-Phys., Trader.
1/12 - Bureaucrat, Doctor, Nano-Tech.

Engineer can do > 2750 AR so AR multiplier for Troller will be 1+1000/400+(2750-1000)/400*1/6=4,23

4. Minimal AS=max dmg*AR multiplier+add dmg

If I used Troller, It would be 225*4,23+567=1519

5. Minimal critical AS dmg=(max dmg+critical dmg)*AR multiplier+add dmg

If I used Troller, It would be (225+100)*4,23+567=1942

6. AS=minimal AS*AS multiplier. Critical AS=minimal critical AS*AS multiplier. AS multiplier depends from size of AS skill.

AS multiplier is randome part of AS it could be 0,5, 1, 1,5, 2, 2,5, 3 etr (I've made a misstake on my enfo some time ago. I was swapping supernova and didn't make AS maximal. My AS skill was less than 500 and AS multiplier was 0,5. I was really surprised becouse i thought that 1 is minimal.) I was testing AS with different sizes from 1500 to 1800 and I can tell you that AS multiplier is random. When i was testing it with 1650 skill 80% of AS multipliers were: 1, 1,5, 2, 2,5 and 20% of it were AS cap, so i cant tell you was it hier multiplier or critical AS.

I suppose If your AS skill is less than 1000, minimal AS multiplier will be 0,5
I'm shure If your AS sill is more than 1000, minimal AS multiplier will be 1
I suppose If your AS sill is more than 2000, minimal AS multiplier will be 2 ore 1,5

Ps: Troller Adventurer AR multiplier=(1+1000/400)*(2750-1000)/400*1/3=4,96. Thous formulas works as well and you can count your minimal AS dmg to 1 point (i've checked out them on crappy AS weapons without add dmg)

Very good post. Stick please. Or add it to the "Important Engi Link"-collection.

[Otansaanpas]

3. Professional coefficients:

1/2 - Agent, Mart.Artist, Shade.
1/3 - Adventurer, Enforcer, Fixer, Keeper, Soldier.
1/6 - Engineer, Meta-Phys., Trader.
1/12 - Bureaucrat, Doctor, Nano-Tech.

shade has 0.29 FC-multiplier and not 0.5
doctor has 0,17 (about 1/6 then)..

are rest correct?

[Scvm]

are rest correct?

No, not really. I think those are the numbers FC gave around the time that the post-1k AR nerfs were implemented (SL launch), and are pretty rough approximations.

Agent: 5.16 dmg. mult. at 2750 AR [~38%] (Source: this one time i asked an agent to crit a leet and tell me how much add dmg he had)
Martial Artist: Seems to be around 20% nerf for 2k-3k AR and 10% for 3k+. Possibly a lesser nerf for 1001-1999. (Source: rough testing with my own MA)
Adventurer: 32% avg. post-1k multiplier. Follows sigmoid curve with certain AR ranges giving very little dmg increase, which is likely true for all profs but more data needed to know that! (Source: Here and Here)
Enforcer: around 4.71 dmg. mult. at 2750 AR [~28%] (Source: This thread)
Fixer: 29.4% avg. post-1k mult. (Source: This thread

It should be noted that all these fractional values are always going to be averages of every point of attack rating between 1000 and whatever AR value you happen to be comparing. It might be more useful to compare the actual damage multiplier at a given attack rating when comparing between professions.