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Thread: City Plot Prices and Upkeep

  1. #21
    rather spend my time helping others and new players get stuff they need and socilising. the 2 220's i have dont need anything so i usly only do endgame raids if a crat or nt is needed and i dont roll on loot unless its something i can use for my 200 fix ive been working on for the last 6 months.
    [GM]: Is there anything else I can assist you with for now?
    To [GM]: lol can you tuck me in bed please im tired xD
    [GM]: Haha, that's a new one! :P

    Rikaria 220/30/63 NT sent to bio matter reprocessing
    Strinarry 220/30/61 Crat eat you heart out hotbars
    Emmantion 200/30/58 Fix is it dead yet >.<
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  2. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Rikaria View Post
    rather spend my time helping others and new players get stuff they need
    and one of those things is making sure they have a city. looks like upkeep is fine.

  3. #23
    i was not talking about org members i was talking about noobies to the game that are not in an org and have just started. i used to give them 1-2m and help them in subs/totw/steps/ even follow em about in sl with a doc to heal them till they get to know there toon a bit or a fix just for +dd buff or a hot.

    but this is going off topic so ill shut up about this.
    [GM]: Is there anything else I can assist you with for now?
    To [GM]: lol can you tuck me in bed please im tired xD
    [GM]: Haha, that's a new one! :P

    Rikaria 220/30/63 NT sent to bio matter reprocessing
    Strinarry 220/30/61 Crat eat you heart out hotbars
    Emmantion 200/30/58 Fix is it dead yet >.<
    Kamiashi 200/00/00 Soldier (froob) spoilt child

  4. #24
    100m/month is nothing really...
    I've been keeping mort 2a for more then 3 years alone, with 105m upkeep just because i like it. (full city + decorations)
    if you have an org (more people), then 100m should be the least of your concerns.

    edit:
    who cannot afford this, its probably extra lazy, or a new player. if he is new he has a goal, something to play the game for, something to look up to etc... if its the lazy kind? keep asking for 100k at grid...
    also high upkeep is ok for reducing ingame credz, economy is haywire anyway.
    Last edited by Khrystanna; Jan 19th, 2013 at 13:35:45.
    Been here, done this...
    Time to move on...

  5. #25
    100M is like net profit from one or two items you buy and sell...

    Some of has had low rents for long time, but some things change. It can be hard for very small orgs... But you have to make trade-offs sometimes.
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  6. #26
    or maby have RL stuff and commitments in other mmo's

    offering credit exchange 1:1 EvE for AO
    Last edited by Rikaria; Jan 19th, 2013 at 13:41:44.
    [GM]: Is there anything else I can assist you with for now?
    To [GM]: lol can you tuck me in bed please im tired xD
    [GM]: Haha, that's a new one! :P

    Rikaria 220/30/63 NT sent to bio matter reprocessing
    Strinarry 220/30/61 Crat eat you heart out hotbars
    Emmantion 200/30/58 Fix is it dead yet >.<
    Kamiashi 200/00/00 Soldier (froob) spoilt child

  7. #27
    Just to compare, we currently pay under 56m for a city with every single buffing building, a guardhouse(soon to be a buffing bldg), and a park filling in for the old market building. I do think the ECM and uplink ought to be rent-free structures.

    .
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    Dagget
    President,
    Venice Academy

  8. #28
    Okay, I thought I remembered somewhere that the new city system would bring changes that were beneficial to players compared with what we have now. I can't find where I read that to save my life, but these new prices don't really seem to fit in with that philosophy.

    Quote Originally Posted by Windguaerd View Post
    A TL7 can easily make a billion in a week with not much effort, probably 2-3 Bill if the player puts all his effort into it.
    I'd agree with you, except that effort and time are two different things. I was able to make a maximum of a billion a day before (most of which has been swallowed up by our existing city rent in the meantime), but then I graduated from university and got a job. And quite frankly, I don't think anybody wants to log into their favorite MMO at the end of a working day only to think "oh great now I have to start farming creds for the damn city instead of just, you know, enjoying the game". Way to ruin your hobby.

    Quote Originally Posted by Windguaerd View Post
    Regarding your statement "some orgs dont want loads of players as it causes drama", well that depends on the leadership of that org. If you allow drama, it will happen, if you put your foot down and let members know that they will get kicked... the chances of drama drop drastically. You can have a mid size org with no drama without having to lose the fun or camaraderie factor.
    It's not always that simple. Although you might be aware they exist, you don't actually realize just how many drama queens, trouble-makers, leechers and trolls there are in this game until you've been that person everybody dumps their complaints about other people on. I'll bet if we made everybody join the same org and then started kicking the trouble-makers, we'd be left with a smaller org than you'd expect at the end of it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dagget View Post
    Just to compare, we currently pay under 56m for a city with every single buffing building, a guardhouse(soon to be a buffing bldg), and a park filling in for the old market building. I do think the ECM and uplink ought to be rent-free structures.
    ^ This. At the very least.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lliers View Post
    I want to emphasize that healthy organizations are what keep people engaged in AO. Raising the city upkeep does not correct the AO economy. It just forces out all the smaller orgs and will eventually hurt the player base. I hope that after the merge is completed, FC will reconsider allowing froob orgs once again, as well. Support the formation of orgs is beneficial. Some amount of "org abuse" for the sake of creating farm orgs must be tolerated so that we can have wide variety of orgs for players to choose from.
    ^ Also this.
    :E

  9. #29
    Lets call this what it is -

    1. An attempt by FC to remove farm orgs (and small player orgs?)
    2. A credit sink

    OK, the push to remove farm orgs - then make the CC be instantly raidable so folks don't need multiple cities to farm lead bots during their hours of play (the sitting around to put the CC on, wait an hour, take it down, rinse and repeat). I never understood this logic - as long as you have CRU for the CC - remove the timer locks.

    But I also don't understand the cost punishment - seems harsh for a game that really needs to do better by it's players tbh.

    The credit sink. Now this one I get, but what form of credit input to the game are you planning? Or is the goal to dry up all the current credits? If so, this is just another issue for new players. Player's farming nodrops and instances are just trading credits - but those that go to rent are out of the game - so again, whats the future hold for new credits? Do you really expect an org to do RK loot runs for their credits?

    And, for all you folks that are going to start the "too lazy, earn it, etc.." dont bother, because you are only thinking of yourself and not the health of the game. An org owing a city is not a luxury, its part of the game (heck, I think an org should be able to quest for one).
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  10. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by Belph View Post
    3 db2 runs, as an org, = 120m + any lr sales.

    3 db runs a month, or even in an hour?

    This is outrageous.
    People putting an hour's effort into keeping a fully built city for a month? That would take an org of at least 2 people, maybe 3.

  11. #31
    If cities had been a new thing to the game I wouldnt argue about the price. But the fact is that with the new way upkeep works, if you had a small/medium city before and want to fit all the buildings you had, you will end up with double the upkeep and probably maybe more. The only actual gain we get is the possibility to put up more buildings, for an even higher price.

  12. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by Windguaerd View Post
    Ok, let's do the math.

    100M for a city with all the best buildings for top benefits.

    100M divided by 30 days is about 3.3M per day. That can easily be put together by ONE player (even a froob one), so a small org should have NO PROBLEM covering the upkeep.
    Holy cow, Wind, what are you farming? And can you share your money making secrets with me?

    I play AO -- tops -- about an hour a day. In that time I'd like to do something more than just farm stuff. I'm currently only froob. (And even as a froob, I am often called on to help people twink, do dungeon runs, etc...)

    In my experience, I can make about 1.5M in shopfood per hour. I average about 30M a month. Enough to cover our 22M upkeep and a little more so I can take a month off now and then.

    We are not a farm org. We are a legitimate org and would like to offer city buffs and raids to our members. We do not have a huge plot with all the bells and whistles. The only "luxury building" in our city is the sauna.

    I'm not saying that we want everything for 22M. We just want roughly what we currently have now at roughly the same cost. 30M or even 35M is not unreasonable, but we'd be looking at 45M+ which is more than double what we pay now.
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  13. #33
    For me, I could care less about the rent. Even with the silly high prices, could easily cover it for about 40 years without making one additional penny. But, I have to wonder how anyone in there right mind thinks this will do one thing to add players to the game. There is a dichotomy here. Players who have been around for a decade or more have more credits than they know what to do with and honestly don't care. New players on the other hand have absolutely no way on earth to afford a city of there own unless they want to turn into bot farmers. Also, the tax building ia a farce. The rent on it is 15M and the return, per prior posts, is 1%. So it would take 1.5B monthly sales to cover the tax building alone. It would take well over 130B monthly in sales to cover the rent for the city. I could easily cover the rent from the 1% org tax on the proceeds of my sales under the old market system for our existing city. There is no way one person, except a person who does little but farm bots, can cover the cost from sales tax alone.
    As I have said in several other posts, trying to use cities or other essential game items to extract credits from the game is short sighted and foolish. All it will do is limit the enthusiasm and interest of new players as the benefits would be forever outside their affordability window (I know they could find a existing org, assuming they can find one that takes new players). There is also the credibility issue here. Rents should be closer to what was promised-- no more than an existing medium I city. Otherwise this is another bait and switch by funcom.

    As a side note, it would be nice if discussions were more focused on the issues rather than what appears to be attacks on how others play the game. That is what makes this game so much fun. There is no one right or wrong way to play it, get buffs, etc. With a couple of exceptions, whose posters shall remain nameless in this post at least, every post in the thread has some merit.
    Last edited by Deemure; Jan 19th, 2013 at 17:54:36.

  14. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by Rikaria View Post
    just like Lliers we are not a farm org and most the time i am the one who puts the rent in for our currant city on live (35m). i dont play AO all the time like a lot of players do but i am on AOspeak all the time, thats only because the game is stagnating due to lack of new stuff to do. i like to know that i can login with a few org mates do a quick farm of say alba or some PB's and throw the money in the org bank and forget about it for 4-5 months.

    i play more then just AO i also play RF EvE and (ill ammit it) WoW but i dont see that my org should be screwed over and forced to have a small plot that TBH not even worth of calling it a city plot. yes the small looks nice but not practical for any kind of org bar a 1 man org who only farms bots. using the small nerfs your adds that the building give and in PVP them adds are important. i know the adds are minor but a +skill is a +skill and even more so when twinking.

    i know AO needs a credit sink but the city plot is not the place to have it.

    when the migration happens on live things might be diffrent as Cans Lupis RK2 is going to be joining via GRC (if cool with battle) Hell on Fire RK1 and maby some of HoF will join the org like some of CL are going to HoF.

    but as it currantly stands CL is a PVP/PVM org atm and the new rent it will meen more time farming just to fill the orgs bank.

    /unhappy face
    I'll run in the same issue since there is perhaps 2 or 3 active left on my side.

    But let's be honest : If you are 6, the cost that was made for perhaps 20 players will drop on the shoulders of only 6. It is best to plan ahead.

    I'll grab a large plot and get the minimum of bulding there. Then I'll decide based of how much we can get in the org bank but tbh I couldn't enforce work back when cities were introduced and I will not again. We grabbed a 25m plot when AI was out and could pay it for years... until now that is.
    Last edited by Boltgun; Jan 19th, 2013 at 18:47:01.
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  15. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by Ahndra-Corvid View Post
    I'd agree with you, except that effort and time are two different things. I was able to make a maximum of a billion a day before (most of which has been swallowed up by our existing city rent in the meantime), but then I graduated from university and got a job. And quite frankly, I don't think anybody wants to log into their favorite MMO at the end of a working day only to think "oh great now I have to start farming creds for the damn city instead of just, you know, enjoying the game". Way to ruin your hobby.
    Bingo.
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  16. #36
    Quote Originally Posted by Cinealta View Post
    I also agree with Kinnik ... these rents are too high. We were told the new large city would cost no more than the current Serenity Islands cities. My fully built Serenity Islands city has a rent of 46M ... the new large city costs 45M with the absolute minimum buildings. How is that "no more than" when it will exceed my current rent as soon as I add one 5x5 building beyond the minimum?

    Cine
    Ok, I finished building my city to match the buildings I have in my Serenity Islands city ... bought the ones missing from the org-leader voucher.

    I purchased the Royal-large plot and built large HQ, Mining Ops, Silo, Grid, Swimming Pool and a NLC wampa ... plus ECM and Sat Uplink. Did we need these last two for Serenity?

    The rent for the above came out to 89.5M credits vs the 46,007,000 I pay for the same buildings now. How is 89.5M equal or less than current Serenity cities as we were told in prior monthly updates discussing this server migration? To me doubling my rent for the same buildings is way too high.

    Also ... Why is there a rent increase for ECM, Sat Uplink and Wampas (17M total for the 3, 2M was for the wampa)? These are not buildings that add City Benefits to players.

    I double checked and the Skybar, Cafe, Park and Hot Dog stand did not add to the rent.

    Cine

  17. #37
    im gona log to test now and remove all the junk/unneeded buildings to see what the rent will be on a large plot. the small plot is just not viable at all as evey toon needs a mine and silo and a small cant hold it.

    EDIT coming soon (TM)

    135.5m all less sauna (my error)
    113m NO guard tower or pool
    98m NO tax office

    leaving :
    Large HQ
    Notum mine
    Silo
    landing pad
    Grid
    ECM
    Radar
    4 Whampas

    no change on :
    Sky bar
    Cafe
    Park
    new city vender balloon thingy
    Last edited by Rikaria; Jan 19th, 2013 at 19:13:26.
    [GM]: Is there anything else I can assist you with for now?
    To [GM]: lol can you tuck me in bed please im tired xD
    [GM]: Haha, that's a new one! :P

    Rikaria 220/30/63 NT sent to bio matter reprocessing
    Strinarry 220/30/61 Crat eat you heart out hotbars
    Emmantion 200/30/58 Fix is it dead yet >.<
    Kamiashi 200/00/00 Soldier (froob) spoilt child

  18. #38
    Can't wait to see bot prices when farmers adjust them to compensate for the higher upkeep price.
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  19. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by Lliers View Post
    Holy cow, Wind, what are you farming? And can you share your money making secrets with me?

    I play AO -- tops -- about an hour a day. In that time I'd like to do something more than just farm stuff. I'm currently only froob. (And even as a froob, I am often called on to help people twink, do dungeon runs, etc...)

    In my experience, I can make about 1.5M in shopfood per hour. I average about 30M a month. Enough to cover our 22M upkeep and a little more so I can take a month off now and then.

    We are not a farm org. We are a legitimate org and would like to offer city buffs and raids to our members. We do not have a huge plot with all the bells and whistles. The only "luxury building" in our city is the sauna.

    I'm not saying that we want everything for 22M. We just want roughly what we currently have now at roughly the same cost. 30M or even 35M is not unreasonable, but we'd be looking at 45M+ which is more than double what we pay now.
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  20. #40
    Quote Originally Posted by MassDebater View Post
    Can't wait to see bot prices when farmers adjust them to compensate for the higher upkeep price.
    When everyone else is paying a higher upkeep, they'll have less to spend. Prices will adjust

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