sector 42, november 25th

[ninor]

[North42] North42: [West42] north and west are dead [Kevoupe]



way too many adds way too early in north. Signal Hacker got some dmg somehow.
I think north needs better spot to pull general. Unlike West for example it is way too close to patrollers.

[Vassilis]

[North42] North42: [West42] north and west are dead [Kevoupe]



way too many adds way too early in north. Signal Hacker got some dmg somehow.
I think north needs better spot to pull general. Unlike West for example it is way too close to patrollers.

Tank pulled general on patroller's spawn spot instead of waiting for boss to run in our direction... they spawned on us and when asked to get back to usuall spot ( nw i think), someone moved too close to tower and aggroed hacker (or hacker got targetted, can't know for sure) -> 100+ adds and dead :/

[WC_]

North's demise occurred because of this:

We set up raidforce east of tower, as normal, where we would get no patroller aggro. We killed tower.

Benja, primary tank for Genesplicer, took aggro on Genesplicer. Benja then proceeded to pull the Genesplicer to the south wall, where we were then guaranteed to get all patrollers in area aggro'd. I don't know if he did this on his own, or was told to. I never saw a RL directive to do so, but I could have missed it, and the logfile is too long to search for something I dont even know is there. At any rate, we got 2 of the patrollers almost immediately.

At some point, the RL called for Tankosaurus to move west from where we were. That moved him closer to the tower. The next mongo resulted in this from logfile, the first hit on the signal hacker --> Signal Hacker was attacked with nanobots from Tankosaurus for 1 points of energy damage.

Game over at that point. North raid failed, and was certain to fail. 2 mistakes. The first one we could have recovered from. The 2nd was certain death, as our knowledge currently stands on how signal hackers work.

-----------------------------------------

I was talking a bit with Tankosaurus after the raid. After talking, I have concluded the best way to handle the North tower is as follows:

Pre-Genesplicer tank set-up

Genesplicer tank reduces his reflects to under 11%
"Adds" tank gets full RRFE, and gets Guardian as needed during boss fight.

Raid-force set-up and fight

North raid force sets up due east of tower, but away from east wall sufficiently to not get patroller aggro. There's only a small area there where we are far enough from signal tower to have no chance at aggro from signal hacker, which comes from the SW fence area and only moves as far as the tower to rebuild it, and away from east wall patroller aggro. Note that this spot is sufficiently far from tower, that the signal hacker is not within range from ranged weapons, as he rebuilds the tower. At least not my Kyr pistols. Maybe agent can reach it, not positive.

Genesplicer tank uses single taunts only on the genesplicer, to maintain aggro on it. This allows a 2nd tank to mongo all vektors and larvae. There are NO other adds except the vektors and larvae at North tower, unless someone hits the signal hacker. Done right, this doesn't happen. The 2nd tank uses mongo to grab aggro on all adds then. Note that both tanks are occupying the same spot, and the entire raidforce maintains 1 blob.

Why 2 tanks, and why not Genesplicer tank to also tank adds? Because the Genesplicer casts a nano on whoever he attacks, to zero out reflects on that person if his reflects are over 11%. That means, that the tank can't gett RRFE, or use guardian while tanking. The 2nd tank, that tanks the adds, can though!. This allows the tank that will end up with the most damage (from mass larvae spawned from the massive vektor wave when genesplicer under 3 bubbles), to not only use RRFE, but also to receive a guardian when it's most needed. Best to save 2 guardians just for the 2nd 'adds" tank, when larvae start popping when boss is under 3 bubbles.

That's how I think North should proceed next time. I very much wanted to be part of a successful 42 3-tower raid, to spawn and kill the admiral. It appears that I will have run out of time to do so, unless we try again tomorrow (Sunday), as I must leave AO very soon.

[Vassilis]

North's demise occurred because of this:

We set up raidforce east of tower, as normal, where we would get no patroller aggro. We killed tower.

Benja, primary tank for Genesplicer, took aggro on Genesplicer. Benja then proceeded to pull the Genesplicer to the south wall, where we were then guaranteed to get all patrollers in area aggro'd. I don't know if he did this on his own, or was told to. I never saw a RL directive to do so, but I could have missed it, and the logfile is too long to search for something I dont even know is there. At any rate, we got 2 of the patrollers almost immediately.

At some point, the RL called for Tankosaurus to move west from where we were. That moved him closer to the tower. The next mongo resulted in this from logfile, the first hit on the signal hacker --> Signal Hacker was attacked with nanobots from Tankosaurus for 1 points of energy damage.

Game over at that point. North raid failed, and was certain to fail. 2 mistakes. The first one we could have recovered from. The 2nd was certain death, as our knowledge currently stands on how signal hackers work.

-----------------------------------------

I was talking a bit with Tankosaurus after the raid. After talking, I have concluded the best way to handle the North tower is as follows:

Pre-Genesplicer tank set-up

Genesplicer tank reduces his reflects to under 11%
"Adds" tank gets full RRFE, and gets Guardian as needed during boss fight.

Raid-force set-up and fight

North raid force sets up due east of tower, but away from east wall sufficiently to not get patroller aggro. There's only a small area there where we are far enough from signal tower to have no chance at aggro from signal hacker, which comes from the SW fence area and only moves as far as the tower to rebuild it, and away from east wall patroller aggro. Note that this spot is sufficiently far from tower, that the signal hacker is not within range from ranged weapons, as he rebuilds the tower. At least not my Kyr pistols. Maybe agent can reach it, not positive.

Genesplicer tank uses single taunts only on the genesplicer, to maintain aggro on it. This allows a 2nd tank to mongo all vektors and larvae. There are NO other adds except the vektors and larvae at North tower, unless someone hits the signal hacker. Done right, this doesn't happen. The 2nd tank uses mongo to grab aggro on all adds then. Note that both tanks are occupying the same spot, and the entire raidforce maintains 1 blob.

Why 2 tanks, and why not Genesplicer tank to also tank adds? Because the Genesplicer casts a nano on whoever he attacks, to zero out reflects on that person if his reflects are over 11%. That means, that the tank can't gett RRFE, or use guardian while tanking. The 2nd tank, that tanks the adds, can though!. This allows the tank that will end up with the most damage (from mass larvae spawned from the massive vektor wave when genesplicer under 3 bubbles), to not only use RRFE, but also to receive a guardian when it's most needed. Best to save 2 guardians just for the 2nd 'adds" tank, when larvae start popping when boss is under 3 bubbles.

That's how I think North should proceed next time. I very much wanted to be part of a successful 42 3-tower raid, to spawn and kill the admiral. It appears that I will have run out of time to do so, unless we try again tomorrow (Sunday), as I must leave AO very soon.

Having 2 different tanks can be a mess, as it's hard to give orders.

At some point, the RL called for Tankosaurus to move west from where we were. That moved him closer to the tower. The next mongo resulted in this from logfile, the first hit on the signal hacker --> Signal Hacker was attacked with nanobots from Tankosaurus for 1 points of energy damage.

It wasn't asked to tanko to move a little bit west (nw or sw i don't remember) but to benja which was faaaar east on patroller's spawn spot. But there was so much people shouting in bot and asking for tank to move that noone was reading it properly (same for team chat..). Hell, even the tanks themselves didn't know if they had to tank the patrollers or not. North never failed before with only one tank staying on boss + adds (I can count 7 successfull ones in a row, except once because 3 docs died on fence and tank went ld when boss spawned).

We also killed north a few times WITH hacker adds. The problem is that we usually kill the big boss down to 30-40% hp before he starts spawning adds, and then one team to kill boss while the others kill adds. It has always worked and never failed... except this time since adds spawned before we could even kill the first patroller... and then we got even more on hacker. It's impossible to outkill adds on north spot, we tried it several times. The only way to do it is to farm as much damage as possible before he spawns adds. Last problem : docs need to concentrate on two different tanks too, which is not easy when there are high crit potential hits.

[Tankosaurus]

Splitting the tanking will not confuse anyone if they know what the gameplan is. One doc, maybe 2 will be more than enough to keep whoever is on the general alive (hence the 2 docs in their team), and so the rest of the docs and advies at the raid would be healing the person with the adds.

If your choices are to have someoen with 9% reflect tank every mob, or someone with 39-59% reflect tank everything except the boss, it is a very very easy answer what is going to be the more reliable choice when you do not have 10 docs behind you.

There is no need to point fingers at who screwed up at north, I knew better than to move west when you told everyone to, but i saw everyone else move west and had no choice but to stay with the blob since it was too late. More than one person was at fault there.

I still think splitting the tanking is the best and most reliable way to get the job done with the limited number of docs and the reflect ripper present on the Genesplicer.

I agree that killing patrollers is never a good idea, they should not have been called even after they agged us, they simply take too long to die, and vectors are more threatening.

[WC_]

I agree that vektors are far more threatening than patrollers. More threatening than even teh Genesplicer.

I'm pretty sure that the vektor spawn isn't tied to time, but rather health level of the Genesplicer. Each wave of vektors is fixed to spawn at a given health level. If we wanted to stop vektor spawns, we just have to stop damaging the Genesplicer.


It was not my intent to point fingers, and as I typed my post, I feared you might take offense, Vass. My intent was to explain why North failed, as well as I could. Experiencing failure brings us all wisdom, as long as we learn from our mistakes. We can't learn, though, unless we know what the mistakes were.

I think you got confused about directions, as the directive was for Tanko to move west, which was toward the tower. It is easy to be very harried RL'ing, when things don't go right as planned. Split second assessments and decisions have to be made. This is why I told Kev I didn't want to RL a raidforce. It would have been too much pressure on me. Everyone, particularly myself, appreciates the effort you've put forth, and the fact that you've stepped forward to RL a group. I did not, nor did anyone else. Thanks

[ninor]

I think some more practice runs would help, 1hr of axp farming and then boss. There were still 42 noobs again in raidforce and local RL need more practice as well. Not only north but all bosses so tank docs and all others know waht to expect.

[Healyhatman]

http://aowiki.de/Bild:Ap42_map.jpg

Arrien showed me that link.... I think someone should edit it and make it a bit prettierwith detailed explanations, so anyone who doesn't have a clue has no excuse and we can ignore them from then onwards

[Vassilis]

I'm pretty sure that the vektor spawn isn't tied to time, but rather health level of the Genesplicer. Each wave of vektors is fixed to spawn at a given health level. If we wanted to stop vektor spawns, we just have to stop damaging the Genesplicer.

I'm not sure about it. Because we got some of them when his hp was at about 85% yesterday (on top of the hacker adds) and they kept comming in. Usually, the boss' health is closest to half his total hp when the first vektors spawn.

[Tankosaurus]

I would be all for doing some practice runs at the north tower with you, just give me a /tell if i am online.

[kuznechik]

Don't forget to order engis to spam blinds. REALLY helpful

[Cirte]

http://aowiki.de/Bild:Ap42_map.jpg

Arrien showed me that link.... I think someone should edit it and make it a bit prettierwith detailed explanations, so anyone who doesn't have a clue has no excuse and we can ignore them from then onwards

if someone want, i can sent him the "GIMP.xcf" file, with all layers in it.

So you could start with the plain map if you wish (saves the affort to make everything again)

[Healyhatman]

That would be great thanks, although seriously I suggest getting someone else to do it I've never been the artistic type

[Kestin_Doxa]

http://aowiki.de/Bild:Ap42_map.jpg

Arrien showed me that link.... I think someone should edit it and make it a bit prettierwith detailed explanations, so anyone who doesn't have a clue has no excuse and we can ignore them from then onwards

Interesting positions on that map. When we do these boss raids, the last 4 times I tanked West we were positioned due east of the tower spot, and south of the rock that the ranged/docs stand atop.

When we've done east raids to kill boss for loot or testing of tower respawn/airstrike, we positioned ourselves southwest of the tower spot, far enough from the tower/signal hacker aggro but inside the range of circling patrollers. Maybe they do it differently during the 3-boss raids, I'm always at west. Arrien always leads East so if that's who supplied the link, I'm guessing that's how they do it now.

[Healyhatman]

http://www.aowiki.com/Sector_42

That link is better, made a *few* adjustments to it, and you can see I made tiny alterations to the map

[kuznechik]

boss kill points are way off the usual place.

[Healyhatman]

boss kill points are way off the usual place.

Not my fault I didn't put the Xs there