Friday with Means - August 28th, 2009 - The joys of jetlag

[Tazalanche]

Means, are there any updates on the bugged city upkeep issues?

That is the main one where it has been discussed, but there are a couple more scattered throughout the forums.

[torakx]

QFT!

Test SUCKS, Funcom why don't you help us test instead of insisting we grind to test stuff so that we can grind it again on Live!!

The whole basis of testing is to test, not to work up to where you can test or run through the program from start to end. When you want to test function 515 you load the program at 515 and test; you don't start it at 1 and tell people they have to work through it each time you change something. Do you test things that way in office? (Maybe this explains the massive delay of LE...) Why do you expect free testers who are donating their time to you to do it that way?

You have the power on Test (and on Live but nobody should expect shortcuts there) to make things easier, help out instead of hiding behind this veil of propriety. You can jump people levels up and down, you can give items, you can give anything you want. Jump people to Function 515 and let them loose, they'll get the instance or zone or boss fight or w/e done and can tell you how it acts and what they think of it.

Expecting people to spend hours and hours on Test (that they could be spending on Live getting their moneys worth) working towards testing is asinine when you can jump them straight to testing.

wow that is one honest brave and truthfuull post if i ever saw it.
i mean while it could be wrong it is how i feel also.
if you need prof testing for this balance its easier to give people a full setup and then you can test from average character to top geared etc.

[meatybtz]

I spoke my rant and now I want to give you guys a perspective you usually dont get. I was a fairly active tester for some time and here is the gist of some of the things.

My rant was more of an ideallic view of things. The reality is that most of the Live players who come to Test are intentionally disruptive, very demanding, rude, crude and act like they own the place. Over the years this had lead to the situation we have right now where test is very insular, small poped, and frankly sometimes downright hostile to outsiders.. because most outsiders were nothing but trouble and didnt contribute to the team. Think about it this way. This entire game is essentially an EGO-TRIP (total recall style) so just about all of us on live have massive egos to fit well in the big ocean of live. However on Test, your ego is so big you cant even get your head into the pool.

They use the grind as a means of pushing away the kinds of people who wont test things well. Also there are people on there to help you BHs are on when they can be and CoTs are too. The thing is the staffing of people who can help out on Test is numerically pretty small. They are also ARKs, which means they are giving their time for free too. Also Test is a great place to see just how bad AOs servers will be just before they close down... nobody about.


Ideally, Funcom would be more directly involved in the day to day of Test.
Ideally, the player base would have the maturity needed to operate on Test without being nothing but trouble
Ideally, FC would have Test Days and boosts would be handed out to test specific things.
Ideally, we could get some kind of social reward for Testing on Live to show our dedication to AO.

Overall Test has some problems that are not just related to Test itself but to the nature of our community itself that cause more problems. Lack of proper testing has always been an issue.

PS... I want my Compiler Cube because Compainon Cubes are for L00zers.

[Gastastic]

...

Edit: MstrBstrd requested I link this "Cyberpunk enough for ya" work-in-progress Opi head image.

More sprockets please.

Also, launching "test" became such a hassle a few years ago - along with dual patching - that I dropped it. If it isn't auto-patching yet, please make it so, and please include test live as an option under the regular login window.

[shadowgod]

I have a slight problem. All these new atrox/nanomage/opifex heads are great but uh...there's more pressing issues at hand...I realize I'm just a random noob with no experience/knowledge of anything, but is this a bad time to ask Means nicely what his number 1 priority is? Out of:

-The new nightclub
-The new exp quests
-Redesigning character models
-New game engine
-Prof balancing/tweaking/new prof specific 2he perks/aura love/ (Is this getting too intense?)
-Other?

Does funcom really have enough personnel alotted to anarchy to be able to not prioritize and instead sort of work on all these things at the same time?

even tho Means has gone over this more than once already....


you're asking that the graphic desginers start coding and doing profession balancing decisions? or otherwise do things they dont want to do?

[Tazalanche]

Also, launching "test" became such a hassle a few years ago - along with dual patching - that I dropped it. If it isn't auto-patching yet, please make it so, and please include test live as an option under the regular login window.

If you were to decide to dupe the current live client for test & then update, it should go smoothly.... as long as you ignore the VERY outdated instructions on the test launcher page that refers to the current test version being 17.8.0.16 when it is actually at 18.2.0.1.

[Gatester]

I'm gonna actually try going to the test server for the first time "oh noes my test server cherry is gonna be popped!!!"

Until I go on, are no drop items tradeable on test server, and if not, why not? (Might edit this after I go transfer)

[Towerblock]

Cyberpunk ftw!!!

[Technogen]

Until I go on, are no drop items tradeable on test server, and if not, why not? (Might edit this after I go transfer)

No, because it would require a complete rework of the game. Test is exactly like live with some small changes to make it easier for people to talk and populate it.

[Suicidal]

are no drop items tradeable on test server, and if not, why not?

No.. nodrop items can't be traded on test, no you are not 220 in full gear right after character creation, no we don't get some GM buffs just for lulz.. test is like live (here is the main problem), except a lot less people and usually newer patch.

[Aethyrguard]

QFT!

Test SUCKS, Funcom why don't you help us test instead of insisting we grind to test stuff so that we can grind it again on Live!!

The whole basis of testing is to test, not to work up to where you can test or run through the program from start to end. When you want to test function 515 you load the program at 515 and test; you don't start it at 1 and tell people they have to work through it each time you change something. Do you test things that way in office? (Maybe this explains the massive delay of LE...) Why do you expect free testers who are donating their time to you to do it that way?

You have the power on Test (and on Live but nobody should expect shortcuts there) to make things easier, help out instead of hiding behind this veil of propriety. You can jump people levels up and down, you can give items, you can give anything you want. Jump people to Function 515 and let them loose, they'll get the instance or zone or boss fight or w/e done and can tell you how it acts and what they think of it.

Expecting people to spend hours and hours on Test (that they could be spending on Live getting their moneys worth) working towards testing is asinine when you can jump them straight to testing.

Well I'll be a monkey's uncle. Nice post there Ayria. I wonder if hell has frozen over.

[Herkulease]

That opifex head looks awesome. Big thumbs up for the person working on it.

Any idea when we can get a glimpse of the tree/body changes? I know nothing is final at the moment, but a basic idea would be nice. 8)

I would like to request that the next head preview be that of the old trox in my sig. IMO it's one of the best looking and most popular faces (for trox)....puuh-leeeasssseeeee. 8p

Lastly, are there any plans to make similar changes to some of the wildlife on Rubi-Ka? Some of it is pretty dated. If yes great.

If not I would like to suggest that you at least make changes to some of the mobs that appear in the starting areas/low lvls. Leets, Reets, Lizards, Roller Rats, City Guards, Subway/TOTW mobs. Just the areas where a new player would be introduced to the game, but before they had time to enjoy the other aspects of it.

Giving the starting areas that little bit of extra love might help keep a few players interested long enough to see the fun in the game, rather then the graphics.

[Snakebite]

Hey, I curse too dammit.

Aaah, ok...

Consider that a nights worth of suspension then!

[Snakebite]

Its bad form for a forum moderator to moderate the game director, you know....

Nah, it actualy means you're setting rigid limits! But I still wouldn't mod Means anyway, it's too refreshing lol.

[Gatester]

No.. nodrop items can't be traded on test, no you are not 220 in full gear right after character creation, no we don't get some GM buffs just for lulz.. test is like live (here is the main problem), except a lot less people and usually newer patch.

I knew about the other things except I heard you can get item exchanges for reporting bugs and stuff to mods on test.


Just seems common sense to allow nodrop items to be exchanged on test though, is it really that hard to switch off that tag? Dimension = xxx flag no drop blah blah blah.

[Notcrattey]

Yes! that head is amazing, I wish it was available before I rolled my engi

[Mostadio]

Just seems common sense to allow nodrop items to be exchanged on test though, is it really that hard to switch off that tag? Dimension = xxx flag no drop blah blah blah.

This is AO, not common sense land.

[Solstiare]

Smoothing out the body and fixing the low-poly stretching issues of the original model sounds easy...but I can assure you it is not. This is a soul-destroying nightmare working with horrible old files and poorly/undocumented animation code.

I feel his pain.

[shadowgod]

Expecting people to spend hours and hours on Test (that they could be spending on Live getting their moneys worth) working towards testing is asinine when you can jump them straight to testing.

the really interesting thing is. they have the char transfer system to copy live chars to testlive.

however, every few weeks or so, after they "fix it", something else breaks. last i recall, unless they finally "fixed it" again, copies will over write any testlive characters you might have with same name, instead of adding a number to end of the new copy's name.

so the copy system stays broken more than not. towhich, i cant imagine why!

alot of people over the years have screamed, asked, pleaded, demanded that the test server become an actual test server, and not some mini-live. all have been ignored. personally.. i only go there on rare occasion to check something or such. since its a pretty useless place.. especially when you need an item or such.. and due to time-zone conflicts, no one is ever there to fullfill such requests.

a note for FC.... "automation -- it'll set you free".

[Mekh]

...snip...
Please take the time to play a little on Test in the upcoming weeks.
...snip...

Quote from the last time I went to test (Dec 16th, 2008):

I've posted it here in 18.0 forum, because it's 18.0 stuff I wanted to test prior to logging off from test server and starting up this thread/post...

Warning: This is a rant... kinda anyway.... Might be regarded as a suggestion also, but with lotsa negative tones to it.
I could have skipped the negative tone, but I feel it's warranted, so...





Finally got my Doc on to Test server with the intention of trying to get someone to try out fears on me...
Out of several logons I've had there this evening was the first time there were actually people online... even lots it seemed, so I was kinda enthusiastic.... at start.
Then I started asking around, only to find out that the fear nano's only works on BS and that in order to test/try them 2x6 people is needed to start out BS in order for me to do what I thought test was all about.... Testing new stuff.

OK... BS only makes sense, but why require 2x6 people on test to start BS... Kinda makes little sense don't it?

I found a friendly enfo, that could/would help me out, but in order to do so we would first have to try and get 12 people gathered in order to even let me get a try at those new nano's so I could get a feel of what they are all about...




Lot's of people throw out the "Go to test and try it yourself" often and a lot, but ffs I can't be arsed to spend an entire evening just for that, when what it is all about, namely the live servers, has more than enough to keep me busy and entertained while having fun with my org or whatever...

In my opinion Test Server just ain't working good enough for what it's supposed to be, or at least could be.... If you wan't more people to come and test your game, then make it easy, fast and most of all less restrictive there in order for people to test out things...

Examples:
1. Make BS require 2 people... That way any two people can go there to test BS-only stuff...
2. Make a vendor where people can go and get whatever new stuff there is to test... for free...
3. In fact let stuff in all shops cost nothing or at least 1 cred or 1 VP...

Bottom line:
I would actually be more than happy to go there and test stuff and report happily to FC about what I think is good, bad, bugged or whatever, BUT....
I will not do so if I have to spend significant rssources on doing just that... Test your stuff.
My AO life is on the live servers as well as the experience of how things works are from live servers.
I intend to keep it that way and I think it serves testing purposes best that way also, to keep my experience and PoV in line with live servers, rather than the small protected environment Test is as far as I have seen it.



Finally I will repost a post I made once:

Logged on there a few times now, but wtf do I do there???

1. Walk around ICC looking for bugged polygons/textures???
2. Are there any particular things that needs checked/"debugged"... Like a list???
3. Do "they" expect me to play on test as if it was a live server??? At the risk of a character wipe at any given point in time!
4. Why do I have to earn bugsy points to get various kinds of buffs/gear/advantages in order to test FC's new/old content???
5. Why do I get a sense of having to earn the right to test their game for "free", when I'm actually paying FC to do so, by having to pay for my expansions in order to do test it???
6
Some meaningfull answers to the above questions, might help me decide to spend some time on test to the supposed benefit of everyone... Even if I have to pay FC to be entitled to test/debug/whatever their game.


This post is not in any way intended to be hostile or anything, but the way it works REALLY makes no sense to me whatsoever, and makes it really hard for me to decide to spend time on Test, when the alternative is spending time on live having fun with friends and helping them, as well as helping my org run and so on and so forth...