Friday with(out) Means - May 7th, 2010: hbaaaaalllhggrrrrrraaaagghhhhh

[Datch]

I agree - FC should keep the caps. If u r with a good org players will help roll mishs in Inf even if they r 220 with all the research done. Yes there will be times when the servers r short of 220's but anyone who hammers out inf mishs 24hrs a day is likely to go mad anyway.

I would also like to add to last weeks FwM by saying that the Idea of another Omni city but a totally lawless 1 is a very cool idea - place it in the middle of nowhere and make it open pvp also throw i a few borgs and no guards - make it a bit like Escape from New York looked. All in riuns etc. have some shops that sell usful stuff for all lvl's and all sides and it would be a cool place to die.

[Demoder]

I still think it's odd how the *effective* reward keeps increasing all the way to 219, and then suddenly drops like a rock at 220.

[Traderjill]

I've been playing AO since 2004. What that means is that when I first started I was leveling my chars on rk missions (didn't know about hecks existing) and then when I rolled my second char I leveled pre-SL missions. I actually leveled on mobs in Scheol and then Golems in Adonis pre-160 when all of the heck spots there were FULL. I stayed in Adonis leveling on hecks and swapping to Pen as team opportunities arose until 205 and then went to inferno and leveled on outdoor mobs. So I'm not lazy.. not spoiled.. and rarely will you see me complain about the speed of sk gain because compared to what I've had to deal with in this game.. today's leveling options are wonderful. My complaint now is about fairness.. if you do something for one level range.. don't discriminate against another.

It seems that some players (surprises me really) actually want the research caps to stay in and blame 'powerleveling' on the player and feel they should be punished because they didn't max out research before dinging 220. Well I'm glad people feel that they can tell me how to level my player but really I think there is a bigger problem that needs to be addressed first..

when leveling my trader I discovered that for some reason:

1. People stopped doing pen missions.
2. People only wanted to do inferno missions with 220 rollers

I didn't agree with 1 or 2. I hadn't leveled up an alt in ages but my semi- "old school" way of thinking didn't mesh well with what people do today. Unfortunately, I could only get 1 Pen mish team going and I think I only did 2 missions total with a non-220 roller. Finding a 220 roller was a challenge as people in my old org had no desire to roll them. So I did the best i could with a really foul situation. I'd go 100% research at times to get a full research level in all lines then I'd allow myself to level up a bit so I could still have the fun/enjoyment of new nanos and tools to play with (that's what makes the game truly fun for me). Unfortunately, when all was said and done. I dinged 220 and had only completely up through level 8 in most lines. It had nothing to do with poor planning on my part. It was moreso the way the game works today.

Inferno is not fun... anyone that says otherwise well.. give me some of what you're smoking.

My point.. what I'm asking funcom to do is be fair about the daily missions.. that's all. If you're going to enforce the hardcap rule.. don't just do it with 220's.. do it with everyone. If they're not going to enforce them then let 220's get 2 or 3 capped hits to research.. not lose out on up to 60k sk because they're doing a level 9 or 46k or so because they're doing a level 10 research.

[Lheann]

There seems to be a theme that a 220 with research left to do has been powerleveled. The truth is that every day players return to AO that left pre-LE and find their 220's needing 70 research completed.

What I find amazing is that some of the people that make the power leveling statements are the same ones that talk how all the people will come back to AO only when it has upgraded graphics.

From my standpoint I think the caps on research are insanely stupid. At some levels you cant get enough per kill to cap and at other levels you can not only cap the research but your level progression as well with a single kill that most players can accomplish solo.

So what do we do? I would like caps on level 9 and 10 research removed. Even with caps removed they are not going to go away that quickly. Example is that daily's would still take about 10 to complete a level 10 research. and maybe 7 to complete a level 9 research. As for level 8 research getting uncapped I am not so sure about that. Perhaps raise that cap to 10% instead of 5%.

Is it fair to the past players? Probably not in some peoples eyes but you know the next toon they level to 220 will benefit from it so no one is excluded from the benefits.

The truth is that for AO to survive we have to accept a certain amount of wow-ifaction to draw in the players that will bring the player base up to a size that makes AO a big profit generator for FC. And remember if AO is making nice profit it will get more love from the bean counters and Means will be able to do more of the things we all love.

[bitnykk]

invoking maketing/playerback to remove research cap is biaising the debate.

these need no change, beware you loose time & SK rushing to 220 without raising research along. i think that's fair & obvious, if people still want to PL & hurry enlightenment that's their business, not dev's.
the issue with infmishes is the roller level only.

wow-ifaction

and please keep any disney/shrek MMO style comparisons out, thx.

[omegahealer]

So the people that dinged 220 before LE just should get bend over on research then?
your logic is flawed.

[Lheann]

invoking maketing/playerback to remove research cap is biaising the debate.

these need no change, beware you loose time & SK rushing to 220 without raising research along. i think that's fair & obvious, if people still want to PL & hurry enlightenment that's their business, not dev's.
the issue with infmishes is the roller level only.


and please keep any disney/shrek MMO style comparisons out, thx.

And your "I did it the hard way" is not biases. Kettle meet pot. Sorry but your point of view feels very eleetist.

[Traderjill]

beware you loose time & SK rushing to 220 without raising research along. i think that's fair & obvious,

Not all of my toons are in my signature, but feel free to check out just a couple of my TL7's listed (auno.org) and you'll find characters that were TL7 and/or 220 (depending on who you look up) well before LE came out. Please don't make assumptions and say they are fair or obvious because they are neither.

Edit:Let me help you along (keep in mind LE was released Dec 13 2006):
Ameliaamp (dinged 215 in November 2006)
Drameliaa (dinged 220 in September 2005)
Lovesteele (dinged 210 in December 2006)
Fatarapida (dinged 217 in December 2006)
Omegalife (dinged 220 in October 2006)

[erozc]

Caps possibly should exist, but not as they are at the moment... 10% of a level would be a big improvement. Funnily, the issue isn't there only for 220s, but there are points where a lowbie player can get a big mission XP reward but end up losing 50% of it because research and level cap come in. It's true though that at 220 it's the most noticeable.

No cap at all would mean from LE9 to LE10 in one line is about 3 hard missions assuming 160k reward and what, maybe 100k from mobs (can't remember, been ages since I did an inf mish where I got sk). That sounds like a bit on the swift side even to me. LE is old news now and while obviously the caps were first implemented to slow down player progress to LE70, it's time to speed it up a bit. Not getting rewarded for full effort is really meh, and it's exactly what happens in inf missions.

Having said that, with the daily missions, if you can pull off one daily and one BS mission on your 220, it's 10 days from level 9 to level 10. I realize that may be a lot of time for many. It's still probably considerably less than what I spent grinding my remaining 10s out - just stating this before the join date-crowd gets all trigger happy.

[saxobul3]

Having said that, with the daily missions, if you can pull off one daily and one BS mission on your 220, it's 10 days from level 9 to level 10.

You have the prisoner mish and the DOJA chip as well, should cut it down to about 5 days

[bitnykk]

Drameliaa (dinged 220 in September 2005)
Omegalife (dinged 220 in October 2006)

.

So the people that dinged 220 before LE just should get bend over on research then?

lol ... we're in 2010 ? your point is ? make life easier for those not done researches after 5 years (FIVE !), and to PLer ?
bring some solid argument please ...

[Traderjill]

.


lol ... we're in 2010 ? your point is ? make life easier for those not done researches after 5 years (FIVE !), and to PLer ?
bring some solid argument please ...

I think you seriously miss the point. For one, LE has only been out for just over 3 years And I"m not sure about you but I cycle through my chars. It can take some time to get endgame gear, all research complete, ai levels, victory points.... especially if you do anything else in RL besides play this game.

So yeah, there are still alot of people (including returning players that I'm betting funcom hopes will come back when the new engine is out) that will have lots of pre-LE toons that need to do research.

I'm sorry but the slave-mentality thinking of some players is just ridiculous. How can anyone in their right mind support insane grinding. I can understand Funcom potentially saying "more grind=more $$" but if you're a player... LOL

[bitnykk]

LE has only been out for just over 3 years

LE got release mid-2006, we're mid-2010 so that makes 4 years, not 5 or 3. My mistake, yours also.

I cycle through my chars.

i finish one car before jumping into a new one, otherwise you end up with a dozen gimps & the feeling the work's so huge you don't know where to start at. but you're free to play the way you want !

How can anyone in their right mind support insane grinding.

i think you're confusing effort & grinding. i'm against grind in general & that's why i'm happy when FC releases some nice alternatives (quests, dailies, dark ruins). since, i'm all to make efforts rewarded, and accomplishing LE research is an effort. those need no nerf.

slave-mentality

what about lazy-nerfgame-QQ mentality ? see, i can summon biaised argument too ...

[Traderjill]

LE got release mid-2006, we're mid-2010 so that makes 4 years, not 5 or 3. My mistake, yours also.

LE was released on December 13, 2006. It is now May 13, 2010 so that makes 3 years and 5 months exactly actually. I believe I said just over 3 years so that would make me correct. Feel free to check the first posts about LE in the Lost Eden forum area.. it is still active. Also double confirmed the 29.95 payment on my ao account on 12/11/06.. 2 days before it was released.

i finish one car before jumping into a new one, otherwise you end up with a dozen gimps & the feeling the work's so huge you don't know where to start at. but you're free to play the way you want !

Yes, we are all free to play as we want. I cycle through my characters.. play them as the mood hits me. AO is a game for me that is meant to be fun. I spend just days on some characters only to cycle through and spend months on another. I'm pretty sure I'm not alone. If you "finish" a character, by whatever your definition of finish means, and then move on that is your right to do so. The thing is.. when new content comes out... that 'finished' char becomes unfinished again. Case in point, my 220 doc Omegalife has been 'finished' at least 2 or 3 times but new content has made her no-longer 'finished' and I've gotten to revisit her again.

i think you're confusing effort & grinding. i'm against grind in general & that's why i'm happy when FC releases some nice alternatives (quests, dailies, dark ruins). since, i'm all to make efforts rewarded, and accomplishing LE research is an effort. those need no nerf.

I'm not confusing effort and grinding. In fact, getting a reward based on effort is exactly what I'm referring to when I suggest that funcom revamp the way 220's get research. As a 220 in an inferno mish you will do more damage, healing, mezzing (think I've already said this before) than non-220's in your team.. even moreso if you're in an end-game setup. The reward however is not proportional to the level of effort. I'm glad you agree that effort should be rewarded however.. so feel free to bump my suggestion.

what about lazy-nerfgame-QQ mentality ? see, i can summon biaised argument too ...

Lazy, nerfgame QQ mentality? Please... save that for someone that hasn't leveled before all of the 'easy-mode' methods were developed. Games develop and progress and I'm sorry but I'm not one of the people that is going to tell you that just because I had it hard that everyone needs to have it hard as well. The truth of the matter is that at other level ranges funcom has gone out of the box with the way the mission reward works. It is bypassing the usually caps and I am proposing that it is only fair that the same thing apply for level 220 chars. That's all.

[candle-645]

While talking about LE research cap, you all forget one very important thing: Extra SK weren't wasted during these days, it goes to global faction research.
Removing cap from level 10 (but ONLY level 10) researches might be OK, but I think it will be better if we get some new global researches. Not something OP, like existing ones, but useful for whole faction and each particular player - research hud item, that gives you appropriate AI tech level perk, small side XP boost (like 5% when fully completed), extra IP reset (this research safely can be made endless ), etc.

[bitnykk]

stuff

quick answers : 3,5 years if you like anyways that doesn't make the pre-LE 220 toon argument valid anyways. also admit that actualizing a toon with new patch is way faster than raising it from level 1/0/0 naked, please be honest.
beside that i don't see why 220 should get more than others, you also see gimp 220 leeching missions just because they roll highest reward ... to me the need of 220 to roll good reward should be fixed, and they should go on winning a reasonnable % of their current research as anyone. doing as you said would give more reasons to people to rush 220 & i'm 220% against that, while everyone is free to do it : just know rushing will make you lose SK doing researches after enligthenment.

so i don't bump your suggestion at all, while candle one is more worth of interest (about new global researches).

[Gimpeline]

Suprice, suprice. Not a word about storyline in the post

I definitely would like to call a generalized "player meeting" at some point in the near future, but I don't feel like I'm *quite* at the point where it would have its maximum beneficial potential. You guys will be hearing more from me in the next month or so, though, and after I've been able to lay down some ground work you'll most likely be seeing me call for a player meeting. =)

This was posteed october last year. Any news? Or do we have to wait untill every hecknoob.. sorry veteran that have leveld 100 alts on hecks in the game is happy?
Fridays with or without means would be more beleavble if gm's kept theit words. Untill that time I take is for what it is...

[MassDebater]

WAH WAH plz no remove cap because player can plevel in 2 weeks WAH WAH.
1) thats not a bad thing but w/e
2) players who dont play that wayie me, will not roll another tl7 until the massive grind gets lowered, and this stupid cap is one of them.

Its more enjoyable to get to 220 and utilise certain parts of your toolset while researching than it is to be a gimp stuck in inf grinding missions over and over, depending on the charity of others.

[Thamar]

Once again you've got a new armor (ICC) that looks GREAT on a male form... and positively STUPID on a woman.

No armor since launch (FEMALE cyber) has an armor been designed on the female form. From the creases in the pants being in the wrong place for the rear to the 6 pack abs and the wrong placement for the girls up top...

REALLY want a female screwdriver to zap all my armor and turn it into a female variety.

[Neosh1]

me want new FWM, a good one with new engine video