Roots - Overpowered, Over used...

[Internalfireh]

This is not an invite for long range rooters to strat flaming, read this post and dont give me **** about our profs (melee profs) always want love, additiosn and stuff ot make us ub3r. DOnt even THINK about it.

Now that little disclaimers done ill begin.

I understand that Roots are an important part of ranged users. I also understand (understood!) how important it was/still is for meele users to be able to break roots (expception of enf here). I play a lvl 122 MA, i will now never fight a root enabled prof in pvp WHy? because i justs pvped a 106 agent and dint even get in combat range before i died never mind do any damage.

Even in notum wars the root breaking items are fkin useless, 10 secs atack so ive heard. WHy are they useless becuse that root able prof can cast the pwest ql root available and it can be as effective as a ql200 (because rooting chances is done on a skill check on the roots reqs against the target) the only difference is is duration, which is in fact not a probelm as a start up root uses miniscule nano even your nano delta could cover and only takes a 0.1 of a second to cast.

Roots enable rnaged users to totaly ground any class but effecting meele users for the fact they cant hit thier opponent at range.

THis post is mainly to identify the fact that roots are overpowered, THey are chain castable, use no nano worth mentioning, and are too effective at thier job, NR doesnt work even if it did there is no way youll get more NR than your targets main Nano skills.

My ideas are as follows:

> Roots Have dramtically incresed recharge times,enuf so that chain casting is possibel but not 60 casts per minute!
>roots lock the required casting skill for a set time - another method of a long recharge but could effect other nanos requiring the same reqs as the roots
>We have an effective method of removing roots
>Roots break on a Minimum amount of dmage, 10% of your hp, a set amount according to the roots level. I think a set amount per level is an extremely good method as it prevents rooters fomr using a start up nano effectively Start up root "renders the target unable to move for the set period of time, but breaks under 30 Point of damage to the target"


Are roots intended to work as they currently do, werent they introduced to allow rooting classes to escape combat? Not to avoid it but still fight back?

Roots were 'nerfed' back in the early patches because rooting classes were to strong and could keep thier target out of range for un-acceptable levels fo time. Isnt that the fact of the matter now?

The new methods of breaking roots are unacceptable, from what ive read of the Docs ncu cleansing nanos there more of a debuff and useless when u can get rooted in a 10th of a seconds time after being cleansed.

I hope FC read this and address this issue and post tier ideas about what should be done about roots or conversly why they think they shgould remain as they are. I really want to see an official repsonse here, if I dont why should i buy the booster? I wont be going anywhere near any towers if the root situatio stays the same so why should i btoher paying to keep away form them?

Thats all from me,
Internalfire (MA)

[ethernal3]

I believe that the skill check against nanoresist should be that of the root rather than the current skill of the root caster, so a ql 1 root would never land on someone with decent nanoresist. (Naturally, if they are using the top root, it morphs to equal their highest nanoskills.)

~Chris

[______________Sredni]

They should work like the crat charms which have a hard check against psychic before the nano resist check.

Just have roots check against agility or something, a ql 5 root would only root someone with up to 50 agility or something; "Damn! this player is so agile I'll have to use my higher ql roots!". And then if the roots high enough ql to beat the agility check, then it checks against nano resist and lands.

Nothing is more annoying to my enforcer then gettting chain rooted by those low ql roots and having to spend all my nano on rage now, when the rooter still has enough nano to chain root for another 20 minutes.

[ethernal3]

Just have NR check against the skill that the nano is required to use rather than the nanoskills of the user.. the fix is that simple..
~Chris

[________________Alli]

hmm, a post where i agree 100% with megabio ? i don't know how to act.

[ethernal3]

Don't worry Garzini. Pinch yourself. It's just a dream.
~Chris

[Abalz]

Originally posted by Internalfire
I play a lvl 122 MA..

Internalfire (MA)

so get to level 200 and heal yourself duh.. MAs can heal and FoL themselves - most root users can't. You don't see us whining (much) about us wanting heals. Not every class can have everything, but MA has everything they need.

[Achmed20]

just use nanoresist. taht skill is ment to block incomming roots and snares.

my lvl 243 fixer fought aggainst a lvl 176 MA last days. my only tactic was root and shoot.
every 5th attamped to root him hit him. for but for just a few secs. mainly due debuffs. and btw ... i used teh strongest root i had.

so ... keep ur nanoresist high, imp it for pvp and then ull be happy. if u get rooted aggein, use those deroot stims. may take a long cast time but better then just stand tehere and wait for death

btw, snares and roots r nerfed a bit for NW so realy nothing to worry about. there r also still teammates which can free u from roots.

[_____________Meurgen]

Originally posted by Achmed20
my lvl 243 fixer fought aggainst a lvl 176 MA last days. my only tactic was root and shoot.

See? Look at that level gap. FC really should work on the PvP level ranges. That poor MA didn't stand a chance you ganker. :\

[________jdiobwanknby]

Well maybe MA's can heal themselves but what about engies?
We cant PvP worth a crap anyway (we r the worst PvP Prof in the Game) and we will NEVER be able to heal ourselves no matter what level we make. All root professions have to do is root us and our bot and we r toast. Those nano lines FC is talking about bringing out will be useless because by the time we cast them on the bot and ourselves (if we have one for ourselves) we will be dead. Not to mention they dont last very long anyway.

[______________Shatai]

Originally posted by Achmed20
my lvl 243 fixer fought aggainst a lvl 176 MA last days. my only tactic was root and shoot.

And how, pray tell, did you reach the astonishing level of 243? This isn't in NW beta, is it? I thought level cap wasn't being raised until Shadowlands *shrugs*

Oh, and btw, MA heals, 8 sec recharge. You will outdamage our heals, and we will run out of nano. And we can only use Flower of Life once every 5 minutes (because that's how long it locks MA for). Not that any PvP fight lasts that long, right?

edit: Just like to add, I like Megabio's idea. Might give us more chance to resist mobs' debuffs. Anything with a high NR check though, would never land on anything worth using it on.

[Whitesand]

Well all classes which cannot root have the same problem. I as a soldier hate roots now. I don't hate ppl rooting me once but I hate it when ppl chainroot me all the time. And being unable to break roots is very hard too. I felt this all times before when I cast tms and someone roots me.

But on the other side I agree to roots, they are a very strong instrument in pvp fights now. I would say one of the strongest things a player can cast in pvp now. And rooting classes should be aware of what power they have now. I only hear them crying that they need some love. Guys you can root thats much love you have. Use your roots wise and you are unkillable!

But one change I would love to see. A root should still be very hard but a root should be something for defense and not for offense what I mean is. Let the root breakers recharge time 10sec np with that. But I have a problem when I see that some classes gets enormous love from funcom and are able to debuff the roots and other classes not. Comeone FC why do u give enforcers a rage a mongo and a challenger? And a 20% crit buff "FoB" too? You nerf mas cause they have to much critt (uvc) and on the other side you give enforcers all the love you have? I mean thx funcome its very funny now to play my enforcer but its not fair to all other classes what you are doing atm.

It looks like that you have your 3 favorite classes atm. enforcers, fixers and traders. Pls explain me why a enforcer needs a very good healing (Mongo) why a enforcer needs a nanowhich makes the enforcer immortal against nanoattack (+800NR) and also cancles hostile nanos on the enforcers body. And why does a enforcer needs a damage buffs which adds attack and +80 damage and only have a nanoshutdown of 15sec? This is not a enforcer hate thread, cause I love all this buffs - I have a enforcer myself too. But you should see what power you give one class and you should see what other classes have. Well would I play a ma I would be very angry when I see what a enf has and what my MA char has and I understand many MA's crying here.

I have nearly the same problems with my soldier class. Well I agree as a ranged weapon user I still can fight, but thats not the thing which hurts me and you don't see why roots hurts me as well as it hurts you as a ma now. I don't have any chance to resist a root. A soldier have a dark blue nanoresist skill. And with this gimped amount of NR a 50-60 lvl lower NT can root me. Yeah I'm a lvl200 soldier and lvl140-150 NTs can root me. I don't have any buffs like a rage for a enforcer which gives me a chance to resist the roots, also I don't have any buffs which breaks them. As long as I'm in good health then np when someone roots me, but normaly I don't become rooted at this time. Peoples root me when I want to run away - Funcome stole me any chance to escape from battles now! Thats what hurts. And the point is now - do I really need a items which breaks my roots all 10sec? I don't! and thats the funny part on this story! 10sec recharge is to long when I need to escape from battles much to long. With a fixer on my back a 2sec recharge would be much to long to escape from battles too. So will it help me when my hp bar falls down and I need to escape from battles? No it wont. Oh btw. the +800 runspeed on rage is nice too lol. Yes a forcer can escape with beeing immortal against a reroot and with haveing a runspeed higher as every smurf in this game. But my soldier have nothing - and no chance to escape. Next thing will I use the root breaking item in battles when I'm not in danger? No I won't why should I?

Fact is the new root breaking item is totaly useless for a soldier - look at the reasons why it is useless for a soldier. And it is a pain for a ma too or for a eng. We the eng can send his pet after the bad NT and I can scream "kill the bad nt" lol

Funcom fix roots in a way which still gives rooting classes to be able to use them as a very strong instrument in battles but which gives classes like ma, soldiers, eng, docs, etc. (I don't count on enfs cause they already have the best root breaker rage) a chance to still be able to fight in notum wars now. Make roots breakable if we become hitted! When a NT roots us ok with that and np with a 10sec recharge time on a root breaking item. If he roots us to escape or if he roots us to keep us away from battles np with that too. But when he roots us and when he then attack us then the root should immediately break. All roots on players should work like mezzs on mobs. Root us ok - but when you attack then its your fault when the root breaks.

Also when I see what a enforcer has then I ask for a +800 nanoresist on tms too. That would only be fair @Funcom. But well don't change anything @Funcom. Look in your dbs after a year and look at all the high lvl pvp battles in Notum Wars. Look at all the traders, docs, enfs and fixers, maybe a few nts or rarely a crat or a soldier are in this fights too.

A MA want only the chance to fight but you killed his chance with roots and the stuff to break roots now. A Soldier only wants to escape but you killed his chance with roots and the stuff to break roots now too. It would be good when you begin to understand how your own game work @Funcom.

Oh and I see you on the speaking on the meetings you hold. Cz: "Mr. Gaute ma/soldiers/engs etc. cry again that they want love and that roots are very bad stuff". Gaute: "I don't understand all the peoples crying about that. I could understand that melee ppls cry about roots but why doesn't we hear about enforcers? The are melee users too" Cz: "Hmm good question Mr. Gaute - I don't know - maybe MAs are all whiners" Gaute: "And why does soldiers cry again? They are not melee users and they have this uber tms-shield" Cz: "Hmmm don't understand that too Mr. Gaute - maybe Soldiers are all whiners too". Gaute: "Ah well so we have no reasons to change anything for soldiers and mas now" Cz: "Right Mr. Gaute". Gaute: "Oh k well can somebody call Mrs. BigBoobs - I need a coffee"

[____________Bartleby]

roots should break as soon as a hit is landed on the target. otherwise, just put it back the way it was. Every1 should be able to defend themselves. The current root system is just plain stupid.

[_____Real Kinky Ityn]

I agree they should break if you take damage.

10 sec recharge is just silly talk. Most of the classes that have roots are casting classes, NTs, Crats and traders, the only non-casting class (and when I say casting class, I mean offensive nano class) are agents.

Some of the ideas to filter higher level roots into PVP are sound too.

[Sethil]

The problem with Soldiers and roots is:
You get aggro, you gets rooted and you cant break it. The opponent stands out of range and waits to recharge all the specials. If I cast TMS, he simply waits till TMS expires, if I dont cast it, I get the specials on me and rooted again. In a fight 1 : 1 I could survive such a tactic only against an agent or crat, NTs.. maybe.... but not against Trader or Fixer. But this tactic is a favourite in mass PvP, where a single target on a battlefield gets raped by 2 or more player. Get a rooter, who chainroots and the other makes the damage... chaincasting arearoots/snares is the other annoying thing in mass PvP.....
Chaincasting roots for more than 5 times should be impossible.

Here an idea:
Install an Morphing NCU - this NCU should be able to increase the Nanoresist for the amount of points for its QL for each time a root comes in...
Lets say I got a ql200 MNCU, which adds +35 to NR - every time a root comes in, it adds 35 more on my NR for the time of 5 minutes, which stacks. If I get rooted 10 times in 5 minutes, I have 350 NR more.
A ql100 MNCU would add about 17 points each time...
On the other side, NR should cut the roottime down for 1 sec each 10 points in NR, so 1000 NR would reduce the root by 100 sec, which forces the rooters to use their higher roots (with more nanocost).

[MatronVima]

What can I say, except calling you nerfmongers.

root is the only viable means I as a crat have to
even up the odds a bit.

Now that it finally works, you dont like, figgers.

Leave how roots work now alone.

[Sethil]

Originally posted by Vima
What can I say, except calling you nerfmongers.

root is the only viable means I as a crat have to
even up the odds a bit.

Now that it finally works, you dont like, figgers.

Leave how roots work now alone.

If roots are the only viable means for you, you need more love from FC....

Roots are powerful and that has been proven in many other MMORPGs. Every class with the ability to chainroot (I dont say that roots at all should be nerfed) is most likely on the top of the PvP list.

Everytime when things are so powerful, that no resist is possible, the things screw the whole balance...

What you ask for are cheap kills on melee classes now.

Crat vs. MA:
Crat roots MA - Crat goes out of range... smokes a cigarette... filles up his nanopool - Crat nukes, shoot at MA (forget that stupid ninja pet...) and roots him again - time for next cigarette? - ok, begin at step 1 again......
You know the point??

[MatronVima]

Originally posted by Sethil


If roots are the only viable means for you, you need more love from FC....

Roots are powerful and that has been proven in many other MMORPGs. Every class with the ability to chainroot (I dont say that roots at all should be nerfed) is most likely on the top of the PvP list.

Everytime when things are so powerful, that no resist is possible, the things screw the whole balance...

What you ask for are cheap kills on melee classes now.

Crat vs. MA:
Crat roots MA - Crat goes out of range... smokes a cigarette... filles up his nanopool - Crat nukes, shoot at MA (forget that stupid ninja pet...) and roots him again - time for next cigarette? - ok, begin at step 1 again......
You know the point??

Moore love for me from FC ya, I agree. Could also right out be I suxs major at PvP

Anyho, I really got to try this as I have yet to win a PvP fight.

Hmm, also roots do break after a couple shots. And root do have quite the recharge time. I think maybe melee classes have had it too easy in PvP up to now and with the introduction of roots that actually stick some they have to think of tactics in PvP as opposed to only buff up and dish out damage.

evades and nanoresist also work now and with darkblue evades
my evades will always be inferior to MA's and Enfs. not so sure about Adventurers think they have a darker color evades thou.

[Sethil]

My main tactic with my Trader twink is as follows:
Root victim.
1st Drain
Root again
2nd Drain
Root again
3rd drain
Root again
4th drain
Root again
shoot
Root gain
shoot
Root again
shoot
Root again
shoot
Root again
shoot
..... and so on

I could do this with my agent far before 14.6 came up. The 'Root'n Shoot'- tactic isnt new in PvP, but the opponent had everytime the chance to brake the roots with a debuff. It didnt help much...

I will never run out of nano with lowest ql root. How long do you think can i do that with a MA? MAs below lvl 150 dont have the choice to use bows. They need their IPs for other skills. And hey... they wouldnt even able to use them after my drains since they would most likely be overequipped....
Enforcer below the rage level are also helpless.

Ok, crats are gimps in PvP, but other root classes aint that gimped, like Trader or Fixer.

Chainrooting is the problem, not rooting at all

[PhoenixKebab]

Originally posted by Sethil
Here an idea:
Install an Morphing NCU - this NCU should be able to increase the Nanoresist for the amount of points for its QL for each time a root comes in...
Lets say I got a ql200 MNCU, which adds +35 to NR - every time a root comes in, it adds 35 more on my NR for the time of 5 minutes, which stacks. If I get rooted 10 times in 5 minutes, I have 350 NR more.
A ql100 MNCU would add about 17 points each time...
On the other side, NR should cut the roottime down for 1 sec each 10 points in NR, so 1000 NR would reduce the root by 100 sec, which forces the rooters to use their higher roots (with more nanocost).

Before I go into combat, I get a teammate/self/anyone to chain root me - thereby increasing my NR significantly for 5 mins. I run the remover and go into combat enjoying my +300+NR for the first 5 minutes!

The time reduction thing is a good idea though - that would work. Should maybe also apply to other debuffs but with different time scalings, i.e. 1000NR = -20 sec of Ransack/deprives/unmakes. 1000NR = -1 sec off blinds