Please change 175-214 bs to 151-200

[ArienSky]

151-200 and 201-214. That range will be as busy as any other. The old TL5 twinks as well as S7 and leveling people ... the pool of people that can participate there should be enough to ensure that it runs.

Red green and underlined:

Red: "There will continue to be TL5 twinks"
..don't you get that when they change the BS lvls there will be less and less, yet you use it as an argument -for- a change, that it will be active.
You should know how active tower wars are compared to BS..
To me this is far from a valid argument.

Green: sure S7, a little dungoun is caped at 200.

Underlined: lvling people in BS?
Are they insane..?
Are you?

You want lvling people to be the supporting foundation of BS..
ofcause they will not fight, if 150 complained about being cannon-fodder earlier, then just look at it now..
I can not imagine -anyone- finding it fun to have no chace to survive, make your time at all..

All in all: it might stabilise, but the arguments here are extremely silly..

TL5 ran because it was a good place: room for twinking, yet not that much grind and difference in power.
it also gave 150 an incentive to really twink and some did very good.

I do not plan to stop at 200 because of BS, sadly this game has run for me.
I do like a fair fight, and twinking, and unless the rebalancing is really good, I will not see that again.

Fun comes from fair challenge, not "I kill you in 2 sec, because I have items you are lvl locked from using" on top of that a huge span of power.
Just compare 151 and 200 DPS, someone please do, just to show how strange this idea that they should be able to fight fairly is..

..or BS is not supposed to be a fair fight?

Kind Regards
-Ariensky

[Obtena]

Sorry, I didn't bother to read your rant. I'm simply saying there will be a population of people that exists to support the 151-200 BS. None of those archetypes I described are going away or evaporating anytime soon. It's the same archetypes that support the 101-150 range, and it's active as well.

As for FUN ... if you haven't read this before, it's worth repeating again ... BS level ranges aren't determined by a 'fun' attribute, it's more fundamentally about an 'active' attribute. The truth is that if you are going to equate fun to a fair challenge, you won't even find a level range large enough for an active BS to be found around it. Get over your idealistic views of what should happen for things to be 'fun' for you. They simply aren't practical.

[ArienSky]

Strange, it seemed to work fine before the first change..
so it indeed was possible and practical.
I and others found it fun to..

I hope that is short and graspable

Kind Regards
-Ariensky

PS. it is -rather- impolite -and- provocative to start with "I don't bother to read what you have written" especially when the text shows you indeed have.
Then why did you write that starting line? just to provoke a reaction?

[Obtena]

It didn't work before the first change ... there were MANY BS's that never ran. Just because one BS runs well, doesn't mean it was 'working'.

PS. I'm not concerned about polite and provocation. Your post was simply too long, personal and subjective to say something that was rather simply put in fewer lines. There isn't anything silly about the arguments presented. BS isn't about being fair or fun. It's about being active. Once that happens ... then you can talk about doing something for fair and fun with it, IF the conditions are worthy of it.

[-yeny-]

^^ No, the range is 151-200 and 201-214. That range will be as busy as any other. The old TL5 twinks as well as S7 and leveling people ... the pool of people that can participate there should be enough to ensure that it runs. Still, people that have 207 and 214 twinks don't have to do anything different. Some might quit because they don't actually want to compete against twinks their level but that's besides the point.

seems like you didnt got me... i know that the range is 151-200 now... so the lvls 175-200 were added... BUT 175-200 chars are mostly useless cause they arent much better as 170ish chars and they are totally useless for NW and city pvp. so there shouldnt be much players in that range... so the bs wont run more than it allrdy does. when it was 150-174 it was allways running, yeh, cause 150s also participated in that bs range... that was the tl5 range...now its splitted, s10 toons in tl4 bs and the rest in 151+ bs... this change wont make the bs running more. it will be dead until fc adds 150s again... but idk..since so many tl5 chars lvled up...

[Gridpain]

So before we used to have : (based on RK1 experience)
100 -124 : completly dead
125 - 149 : completly dead
150-174 : running pretty often
175-200 : complelty dead (I think i have 1 screenshot of thisone running... I was alone)

Now we have
101-150 : very active
151-200 : somewhat active, saw it run several time, but it's still new.

Do we have "completly dead" BS anymore ? (in that range) no ...

= Win !

[Lazy]

my thoughts so far:

from my experiance the 201-214 bs is more fun now. the removal of greys, while not improving the quantity of bs rounds certainly improved the quality.

from what i've heard from orgm8's a good 170 twink will steamroll 200 levelling toons with relative ease anyway so the 151-200 bs isn't as broken as people make it out to be. and with the influx of people that bs actually runs again.

overall, a good change

[police]

from what i've heard from orgm8's a good 170 twink will steamroll 200 levelling toons with relative ease

Week or two and these 170´s will go splat.
when ppl get their 200´s done with all sugar,it will be pretty much 200-200 bs

[-yeny-]

i doubt that... cause any 175-200 char is useless for NW, city pvp...and they arent much better than 170ish chars. so pvp twinks in that range will be still max lvl174

[police]

i doubt that... cause any 175-200 char is useless for NW, city pvp...and they arent much better than 170ish chars. so pvp twinks in that range will be still max lvl174

Auno.org item database - search
require REQ(level)>=175

just 1 for example http://auno.org/ao/db.php?id=244989

and you cant do city pvp if that even exists anymore or NWs at BS,,and from my experience most of the BS people dont do NWs anyways.

[-yeny-]

so you think ppl make lvl200 twinks for that bs? and just for bs and s7... all those pvp ppl in 150-174 old bs did city pvp and NW! so why to waste a char slot when you can go/stay 170 and do everything? maybe you die 2 times more a bs round cause of not being 200...but yeh, does it rly matter?^^

[Armus]

so you think ppl make lvl200 twinks for that bs? and just for bs and s7... all those pvp ppl in 150-174 old bs did city pvp and NW! so why to waste a char slot when you can go/stay 170 and do everything? maybe you die 2 times more a bs round cause of not being 200...but yeh, does it rly matter?^^

If I am staying Ig I am making at least one 200 specifically for that BS. Maybe even two.

I have 5 old ai20+ tl5 toons just waiting to be transformed into 200 pwning material!

[Obtena]

^^ THIS. I have 'replaced my 165 and 170 'NW' twinks with better, proper level NW twinks. Those will now likely level to 200 for some BS and S7 action.

[Armus]

BS isn't about being fair or fun. It's about being active.

You don't see the connection between fun and it running? No? You sure?

I do.

But then again with a sig that says "I have transcended beyond thinking what is right and wrong." we shouldn't be surprised that you don't.

[Insane666]

so you think ppl make lvl200 twinks for that bs? and just for bs and s7... all those pvp ppl in 150-174 old bs did city pvp and NW! so why to waste a char slot when you can go/stay 170 and do everything? maybe you die 2 times more a bs round cause of not being 200...but yeh, does it rly matter?^^

yes, same as ppl used to make 174s for just BS and no pvm instance at all, becouse 174 rarely do NW anyways, and if they do, they are the first ones to go splat from tl7 twink killers

ppl made maxed out ( for BS ) 174s before, instead of gettin a proper NW lvl, now ppl will make maxed out 200s for just BS/S7


still, compared to the 151-174 + 175-214 its a very good change

[Obtena]

You don't see the connection between fun and it running? No? You sure?

I do.

Yeah I do, but I realize one has a higher priority than the other. 165-174 BS would be REALLY fun, but as it has been shown, doesn't have the population to have it run consistently enough.

[ArienSky]

You apparently seriously claim that:
FIRST you need an active BS
THEN it can be adjusted to be fun..

Where the rest more or less agree, that:
IF it is fun
THEN it will be active

This is a game, people stop(less active) when it is not fun..
Look at the Agent profession as a documented example:
Good at PVP TL5
a -pain- to lvl up there

Result: Only PVP twinks made agents..
those regular players trying mostly stopped because of it not being fun.

.. hence the legendary quote of Agents being the statistically best PVP profession.
.. because only real PVP nerds stood through the boredom of lvling an Agent, most likely with powerleveling, where new starting players, succeeding in other professions got bored of playing agent.

Fun-> active
Try making a restaurant FIRST getting a lot of costumers, THEN make good food..

Have you seen the show "Ramsay's Kitchen Nightmares"?
It shows again and again, that having a restaurant at a good place with lots of people does not give a good economy, if you make bad food..

Some claim "3 seldom active BS is better than 2 dead and 1 running all the time"
Could it be that people preferred having one running all the time, and made toons for that, dropping the others, because it is more fun not to wait in a queue all day?

the 150-174 BS used to run.. they changed it, splitting the community, as some lvled on, then returned it to the old standard.. well they already had split up people.. now they change again..
They have in essence destroyed the active BS community, and given a distrust, as people never know if there twinks will become -nullified- with a blink of an eye..

Kind Regards
-Ariensky

I hope too that we will get the critical mass of one mid lvl BS running constantly, the graphics engine and rebalancing might do it, but for now the course is lost, with messing the lvlranges 3 times..
It was fun while it lasted.
I liked taking a break from PVM to walk to the BS terminal and in 2 min get into a fight.

[Ciex]

But whats your point exactly Arien ?

btw agent is by far the third most easy profession to level after nt and crat. FP - nt /lft ost pew pew pew ( err i mean nuke nuke nuke) -> lvl 170.

[Armus]

But whats your point exactly Arien ?

btw agent is by far the third most easy profession to level after nt and crat. FP - nt /lft ost pew pew pew ( err i mean nuke nuke nuke) -> lvl 170.

He means that if something is fun it will run.

[ArienSky]

agent is by far the third most easy profession to level after nt and crat. FP - nt /lft ost pew pew pew ( err i mean nuke nuke nuke) -> lvl 170.

Apparently you do not know how the agent profession work at the lower lvls:
you have a nano called "False Profession: Nanotechnician" that is QL 40.. first step is getting there, which again is where most people stop, because other professions have an easier time.... well let me follow on your story of super Agent NT:
Read the description:
-25 all nano skills
150% cost modifier
-2000 nano initiative

Actually that is the reason for the boredom: you are not able to cast any combat nano at all, before you can use the mimic line.. which is 160ish for newcommers not experienced in the game..
So your idea of "just" going NT as agent fails..
Please try things out or investigate before saying that a newcommer choosing Agent has an easy time.

What other profession do you need to go through 160 lvls of boredom, before shining?
Take a crat, adventurer, even MP and get some action in an easier way.
Granted Agent has become better, with MP pets being 2 hours, but still, FP MP is QL 37..
Pre-mimic agents are team players; they are buff totems.. because of the -2000 nano init all they can do is equip a high QL gun and have pre-combat buffs..
Root'n shoot is a posibility if you do not go FP, but then why not just go fixer if shoot'n root is what you want..

This is for another debate though, I invite you to read and write on this issue in the Agent forum Ciekafsky.
But saying that lvling an Agent is easy, just go NT, that is wrong, I would like people to know the truth.