BS changes

[Seoin]

Spawn, tab, q, /follow, get zerged, die, repeat.. at least give me something to jump over something while chasing gimps and kiters.. something! I'm bunnyhopping out of boredom! I'm going crazy here! Bring back old bs asap! I couldn't care less about who is clueless or what the exact definition "real" pvp is in ao, I want "fun" pvp!

I want more environments not less! Make an environment and I'd love to fight in it, just not if it's hopelessly boring!

If there were people like there are in bs, and without the waiting and drama of normal city pvp and without the ridiculous zergs of tower and tara pvp, I'd pvp in clon****, I'd pvp in scheol, I'd pvp in broken shores, wartorn valley, I'd even pvp in db2 just for the challenge and the excitement of overcoming tricky and hostile situations and locations. I really couldn't care what prof, I'd try and make the best of it. Push your toon to the max! Overcome the odds!

It blows my mind that we are changing environments to suit easier and less eventful fighting. If you are having trouble in a situation, get better at it. If pet pathing is a problem, fix pet pathing, figure out a way to get your opponent to your pets, or figure out how to not rely on your pets to fight well. If you are kiting me on my keeper, then I'd better get some more runspeed and maybe a root graft or two. You can judge my playstyle all you want, but please do not tell me how to play or where I can/cannot play.

If you like arena style duels and balanced, fair fights, go for it. Enjoy yourselves! There's dozens of locations for you to enjoy that type of pvp. (arenas, duels, abandoned pvp mine, current bs, etc) For those of us who want something more, we're completely out of luck, and many have already given up and moved on to other games. Population is a problem, lack of pvp environments is a problem. BS was the last sorta fun pvp encounter I had. I miss the days in front of the subway, I miss the rp city battles, I don't think people then cared about some agent sniping from the top of a building and some rock that was in the way and some tree that made it hard to see him, or a bench that made them have to tap spacebar to get over. Please stop dumbing down the already dumbed down pvp.

Omg this! This this this! Bump! Could not have said it better. Please FC listen to this person.

Edit: I'm a pet class too btw.

[Xirayne]

I'm not a man, but thank you

Edit: You edited! lol thanks again

[Hanavald]

If BS so dumb and simplified, than how come you seem unable to adapt to it? Push your toon to the max! Overcome the odds!


The hilarious part of this thread is how some people seem to attribute their success in old BS to their skills of keyboard ninja and lightning fast intelect which allowed them to anticipate actions of oponents, while all they actually did is pressing WWWWWWWWWWW while endlessly kiting down 5 mile long corridor and choping 30% HP of hopeless melee chaser every 11 seconds.

God forbid, Funcom actually made a map that encourages combat , and i now have to PvP, in the PvP area? What where they thinking? I wanted to afk leech points from top of the ramps and maybe nuke someone once per 2 minutes while being untargettable. all that while watching Daisy Does Dallas in HD. Stop ruining my fun gameplay.

[Alternity]

If BS so dumb and simplified, than how come you seem unable to adapt to it? Push your toon to the max! Overcome the odds!


The hilarious part of this thread is how some people seem to attribute their success in old BS to their skills of keyboard ninja and lightning fast intelect which allowed them to anticipate actions of oponents, while all they actually did is pressing WWWWWWWWWWW while endlessly kiting down 5 mile long corridor and choping 30% HP of hopeless melee chaser every 11 seconds.

God forbid, Funcom actually made a map that encourages combat , and i now have to PvP, in the PvP area? What where they thinking? I wanted to afk leech points from top of the ramps and maybe nuke someone once per 2 minutes while being untargettable. all that while watching Daisy Does Dallas in HD. Stop ruining my fun gameplay.

I think you are missing the point. There are so many elements that make up PvP tactics that now has been removed from BS. The whole experience turned vanilla.

It's like playing an fps say ARMA 2, and you're loving it because of all the tactical elements it contains. Now say the developers suddenly decided to patch this game you love, and you go download the patch and update. Log back in and you're essentially playing Wolfenstein 3D Now both games are based on the same principle, but I wouldn't stick around after that patch. Ok they have guns and you can shoot stuff in both, but something is missing.

Same for BS here.

[Scottik]

I think you are missing the point. There are so many elements that make up PvP tactics that now has been removed from BS. The whole experience turned vanilla.

It's like playing an fps say ARMA 2, and you're loving it because of all the tactical elements it contains. Now say the developers suddenly decided to patch this game you love, and you go download the patch and update. Log back in and you're essentially playing Wolfenstein 3D Now both games are based on the same principle, but I wouldn't stick around after that patch. Ok they have guns and you can shoot stuff in both, but something is missing.

Same for BS here.

Exactly. Besides AFK'ers/slacker usually CCL about BS layout in the first place specially if their death brings no penalty at all.
Hannvald comments here make me wonder if he's working for FunCom or not. ^^

Btw thumbs up for ArmA 2.

[alfora]

There is a PvP area where you DON'T die and have to rezz and which is located in an area with buildings, hiding spots, and whatnot. It is the PvP staging area which can be reached by talking to the NPC in the BS room.

This PvP area is EMPTY.

Why are you hard core PvPers not going there? Because the fight will almost always end in a gankfest with 220s.

It seems that most PvPers like to fight only under certain conditions:
* same number of people on each side
* same level
* no rezzing
* no outside help (like 220 docs who heal lvl 50 PvPers or the like)
* no teams (many of you like to farm solo kills)


The BS is "won" by capping points. This is (much) easier when you are in a team or at least coordinated enough to TALK to each other and NOT going out to farm solo kills.

I've had enough BS fights where somebody only teamed my fixer for a buff and immediately left the team after he got it. I once asked why nobody but me was capping points and even got sweared at for 4capping!

The new BS makes it even easier to cap because you can choose WHEN and WHERE you want to leave the decon room. In one of my last BS runs my team stayed in decon, talked about who is going where, left decon fully buffed at the same time, and capped A and B. Then we talked AGAIN (*shudder*) and met at core to kill the "resistance" and 4cap.

Our tactic was good and we won easily. But I am afraid we were absolutely not interested in a long running BS.


IMHO, the BS is fine for getting victory points in conjunction with the daily BS mission.

The BS is not fine for people who like to PvP under the above mentioned specific conditions.

There should be an instanced PvP area (like the staging area) whithout control points where only a certain number of toons of a certain level can enter and PvP until their fingers fall off. There should be a score board (similar to the raid interface) where you can assemble teams who will fight each other. You should be able to select the "winning" conditions too, like "number of kills" or simply time.

[Hometown]

Alright then, guess the " I want free vp blah blah blah bs daily *cough* " crowd won.
I can assure you the most active ranges as it is, will run as often as the lowbie ones ( just to get your precious bs daily done! ), and no this ain't a "ao is death death" post.
151-200, 101-150 bs already takes ****load of time to start. Believe it or not, PVP crowd was the one making it active,, those like me who sign up for multiple rounds even if its lost.

Though anyway, I'm done posting. Problems were explained in xira's posts (and a couple others).
Have fun

[lainbr]

What a huge suprise, this change is so unpopular with the very same people who show up to BS claiming they want to PvP, only to get inside and avoid confrontation whenever possible. Hard to really mean it because of AOs small population but who am I kidding: good riddance.

Cool seeing you acusing ppl ^^

BS is the only 'real' PvP anymore. You can pretend otherwise or disagree with the way players have reacted to the new changes (teaming more, hugging core more - although dominant teams already did this in the 'old' BS.. til they got bored and came to the spawn points) but it's still true.

Kinda fun you tell BS is the 'real' pvp, since, in current BS, kill ppl is a disadvantage. I old BS you could at least think that the guy was out of fight for 30 seconds. Now they intaspawn full healed w/o debuffs in your face to gank you. /fun

[SoapTarder]

I wish people would l2p and have some fun. old bs map was boring and predictable, much like how hardcore pvp'ers describe pvm content. people cried for years on these forums for new bs map that was faster paced and more exciting, and now that we have a new bs map (for all intents and purposes) that meets that criteria, there is so much QQ that my monitor is leaking. seriously... how can you call yourself a pvp'er if you cannot even adapt your tactics... I've seen at least one of each profession since patch do very well in the new bs, sometimes using tactics that borderline on genius. at least some people can adapt... if people are 4 capping you, learn to guard the caps instead of lazily hugging core or spawn points

[Lazy]

while the new bs has certain... erm... drawbacks, it's far from "the worst thing that ever happened to ao" that everyone makes it out to be. i can think of a couple tweaks that can be made to fix it a bit tho

1) remove spawning from core. and reduce spawning to a MAX of 2 pads (the ones on either side of the hallway are pretty nice)
2) force first spawn to be at old b for clan and old a for omni. after that everyone can spawn wherever they want. (alternatively start with a and b capped and let players spawn ONLY at pads they "own". )
3) make doubles/triples self-only

there, i just fixed bs for you


here's the thing. those blocked off hallways are useless. no one goes there except daily farmers that want to get away from pvp. and i really do LIKE the instant respawn. makes bs seem more full than it really is. however there SHOULD be places where someone can sit and stim/use virus scanners/rebuff/pick their nose. and while new bs encourages more team-based play, people who like to solo can and do perform just fine in there. there's still plenty of room to kite. the people complaining just need to l2p

tl;dr new bs is fine, but a little rough around the edges. a few small tweaks and it'd be perfect.

[Blackcradle]

There are so many elements that make up PvP tactics that now has been removed from BS.

HAHAHAHA! I thought BS was the least PvP in AO? Who needs tactics? OMG I can't run under a ramp/up a spiral to get outa LOS! I'm guessing the last time you "PvPd" was when clans took towers back YEARS ago.

Kinda fun you tell BS is the 'real' pvp, since, in current BS, kill ppl is a disadvantage. I old BS you could at least think that the guy was out of fight for 30 seconds. Now they intaspawn full healed w/o debuffs in your face to gank you. /fun

If killing people is a disadvantage then I don't see why you of all people would be complaining. I don't think I've had many fights with you that lasted more than 10 seconds - though.

Spawn, tab, q, /follow, get zerged, die, repeat.. at least give me something to jump over something while chasing gimps and kiters.. something! I'm bunnyhopping out of boredom! I'm going crazy here! Bring back old bs asap! I couldn't care less about who is clueless or what the exact definition "real" pvp is in ao, I want "fun" pvp!

Believe it or not some people don't find running around and jumping over obstacles just to get to my target fun PvP. I'm all for pushing your toons to the max but good luck doing anything about my trader running up a spiral while ASing your your keeper to death while you never have a chance to get to me. These are the kind of scenarios the BS changes happened because of.

[Xirayne]

Please read the rest of my post black, I said nothing about forcing you to enjoy jumping or running, you got places to pvp without obstacles or long hallways. Go for it! Enjoy yourself

and yeah I'd be pretty screwed against your trader prolly, but if I was trying to chase you up the spiral instead of lure you to an open spot, or tried to run up behind you it would be my fault for making a poor decision and losing, not the spiral. It'd still be a fun challenge, who knows, maybe I would have caught you, we'll never know now

[Alternity]

Blackcradle you just keep on insisting on proving how infantile you are, I salute you

[Arriviste]

while the new bs has certain... erm... drawbacks, it's far from "the worst thing that ever happened to ao" that everyone makes it out to be. i can think of a couple tweaks that can be made to fix it a bit tho

1) remove spawning from core. and reduce spawning to a MAX of 2 pads (the ones on either side of the hallway are pretty nice)
2) force first spawn to be at old b for clan and old a for omni. after that everyone can spawn wherever they want. (alternatively start with a and b capped and let players spawn ONLY at pads they "own". )
3) make doubles/triples self-only

there, i just fixed bs for you


here's the thing. those blocked off hallways are useless. no one goes there except daily farmers that want to get away from pvp. and i really do LIKE the instant respawn. makes bs seem more full than it really is. however there SHOULD be places where someone can sit and stim/use virus scanners/rebuff/pick their nose. and while new bs encourages more team-based play, people who like to solo can and do perform just fine in there. there's still plenty of room to kite. the people complaining just need to l2p :)

tl;dr new bs is fine, but a little rough around the edges. a few small tweaks and it'd be perfect.

I think I managed to get into fewer than a dozen non-bugged rounds of 101-150 BS before this change. For the most part, I was OK with how it worked at the time. Of course, I'm an adventurer, so the distance wasn't so much an issue for me. I'm pretty mellow about game dynamics and fully expect to get outsmarted and/or overpowered most of the time. Getting farmed at spawn did occur from time-to-time: turrets at spawn, really, guys/gals?

Since the change, I'm enjoying it more. I totally agree with CuisinartBlade's suggestions, though (except the doubles/triples part, 'cause I honestly don't know what those are.) Last round I played there was no communication on my side except in decontamination, and we still managed to keep things lively with good back-and-forth action (wink-wink-nudge-nudge) at core, the other cap points, and in common-area PVP.

I don't have time to notice how fugly the glass walls are, but here's an idea: What if the area behind the glass revealed a hull breach and the texture that is now glass shimmered like a force field or like zone borders?

[Speaking of communication -- how does chat work in Battlestation if you're not in a team? Does all vicinity chat you make go to just your side or is there a channel for sided convo that I'm overlooking? Thanks.]

[Lazy]

[Speaking of communication -- how does chat work in Battlestation if you're not in a team? Does all vicinity chat you make go to just your side or is there a channel for sided convo that I'm overlooking? Thanks.]

right click chat, -> talk to channel -> battlestation

[Blackcradle]

Blackcradle you just keep on insisting on proving how infantile you are, I salute you

Amazing comeback!
So infantile that I keep coming back to 'chime in' to try and save face and get the last word vs someone who has been repeatedly embarassing me over and over again throughout this thread. Oh wait - thats you! Or did you actually have something to say besides shedding your tears about the BS you don't even play on forums? Too easy.

[Arriviste]

right click chat, -> talk to channel -> battlestation

Roger-roger! Thanks!

[Cogline]

As a PvM orientated player PvP is a mystery to me. BUT why is the Hope Bar, Will To Fight, BS 0% gas areas ALL empty if PvP is so important? Seriously, I do BS for the XP but have visited these other arenas for some action only to fine it's me, the bot, and a whole load of empty. Either ALL these areas are flawed or PvP is flawed at a fundamental level EVERYWHERE in AO. Or PvP players are all boo hoo and no pew pew...

[Alternity]

Amazing comeback!
So infantile that I keep coming back to 'chime in' to try and save face and get the last word vs someone who has been repeatedly embarassing me over and over again throughout this thread. Oh wait - thats you! Or did you actually have something to say besides shedding your tears about the BS you don't even play on forums? Too easy.

Too easy? You haven't provided a single useful uttering regarding the matter, other than some faction rubbish, followed by personal attacks on an entire Org.

[Lazy]

As a PvM orientated player PvP is a mystery to me. BUT why is the Hope Bar, Will To Fight, BS 0% gas areas ALL empty if PvP is so important? Seriously, I do BS for the XP but have visited these other arenas for some action only to fine it's me, the bot, and a whole load of empty. Either ALL these areas are flawed or PvP is flawed at a fundamental level EVERYWHERE in AO. Or PvP players are all boo hoo and no pew pew...

no one goes there because there's no one there. bs is GUARANTEED to have people of people. city you are GUARANTEED to have people attack you if you flag up. towers are GUARANTEED to have people show up and try to kill you if you attack them. this is why all those places are popular. if a city like newland or mort were 0-25% gas im pretty sure people would pvp there too.