New weapons #2

[Louderer789]

To recap

Do
Give professions without viable pvp weapons new options (Engineer, Crat, doctor, fixer, ranged adv)
Make these weapons speed-cappable.
Make these weapons equippable by professions who need them.

Don't
Add weapons with split AR
Add weapons only those with perk/symb support can equip but which are obviously much worse (useless weapon theorum)

See original thread for more details, more flames.

If you like FC, you can a)pay me money for all my sweet suggestions and b) ask me to draft some basic figures for these weapons.

[tehacidbaron]

I support this.

Grenade with AS or atleast a pistol with AS.

[Valhallur]

Yes, give my ranged adv a one-handed Dshark, but replace burst with AS, so I dont have to swap FA gun with craphander.

I agree with your suggestion, just not with your list of needing profs (read: advs and fixes). If Im not mistaking from you original thread, you want FC to increase the AS storm further, wich is just the opposite of what we need.

Or, like you want, decent AS weps for everyone, but give it a def check. Would make agents superior AS users, like intended, and make capped AS from a keep with nova w/o ip in the weaponskill or AS, less common.

[Louderer789]

If Im not mistaking from you original thread, you want FC to increase the AS storm further

It's not increasing anything, all of these profs use AS already, albeit from weapons they have no support for and which are old and outdated compared to new weapons given to other professions (read: shark, tigress, silverback).

[crattey]

Fixers perhaps, but I'm rather sceptic about giving advies a reliable AS weapon. Ranged advies already have better defenses than melee advies, giving them a FA/AS combo could really mess things up. Fixers atleast have a very long recharge on their FA, though with their perk damage it's still a bit much I think.

Anyway, if they even do make it to test like this, it will show wether or not the pistols should get a profession tag. (assuming they don't pull the 'insert to live, fix 5 patches later' thing -.-)

[Valhallur]

Fixers perhaps, but I'm rather sceptic about giving advies a reliable AS weapon. Ranged advies already have better defenses than melee advies, giving them a FA/AS combo could really mess things up.

Id say the slightly higer evades, in these sick AR days, by no means outweight the higher HP melee ones have (assuming we talk about CM vs CSS advs, wich sound natural to assume since evades are brought into consideration).

I agree with your what your saying tho.

[candle-645]

I have soldier and ranged advy and I don't need AS weapons for them.
But soldier's didn't get any replacement for JPGPP and KMP5, even doc's (I'm assume they are pure support prof, not damage-dealers) got pistols with way better min/max damage and MBS than good old ones soldiers still use
The same for advies - Ofab Peregrine 6 is better than Kyr Pistol type 4 (but only because type 4 initially wasn't good) and no any replacement for JEPP.

[crattey]

New JEPP would be quite different from a new AS pistol.

Soldiers got a shark

[Nanofox1]

even doc's (I'm assume they are pure support prof, not damage-dealers) got pistols with way better min/max damage and MBS than good old ones soldiers still use

Yeah but the max damage/MBS on those doc pistols is pointless, 99% of the time a doc be hitting min damage with them, even on a lot of RK mobs, unlike soldiers, and the MBS...yeah, a docs gonna reach so near that

To the new weapons: No AS, get creative some more like have been doing recently, and if gonna have a split AR, lower the def check.

[candle-645]

Soldiers got a shark

PvM Wise:
Shark is good option for ppls who like to be acceptable DD, but not up to spent effort on it - and I consider it as very good replacement for SPB
KEP5 soldiers got Dreadloch Rapier - no much difference, but still something.
KMP5 soldiers got nothing.

[Sirmanyak]

PvM Wise:
KMP5 soldiers got nothing.

or just make Dreadloch JPGPP with 15 bullets clip and attack rating cap 2500 and i be love u FC even i need to kill 10-20 Beast in row and hack 54 SPB for make this 1 pistol.

[crattey]

No offense, but soldiers have been asking for a better Assault Rifle for ages. Shark certainly fits that, it's a huge boost.

[candle-645]

or just make Dreadloch JPGPP with 15 bullets clip and attack rating cap 2500 and i be love u FC even i need to kill 10-20 Beast in row and hack 54 SPB for make this 1 pistol.

Yep, new FA pistol with larger clip, better MBS and 2.4K pistol / 2K FA requirement to equip and cap recharge speed is something I dream about

[Pheddex]

give advys a Dreadloch-Explorer-Personal-Pistol...=)

[Reziukas]

Bump for improved jpg+kmp combo! Bring sols back to best DD position again!

[Louderer789]

make your own thread soldierboy!

[Amortia]

make your own thread soldierboy!

Bump

Soldiers should have a nice big Assault rifle not little popguns

[candle-645]

Well, trying to return back to topic

To recap
Do
Give professions without viable pvp weapons new options (Engineer, Crat, doctor, fixer, ranged adv)

Fully agree, if you remove "pvp" from this phrase

Make these weapons speed-cappable.

Definitely NO - there are specials "natural" for each prof - AS for agent, FA for sold, Burst for Fixer, Fling for advy, etc. Any prof shall sacrifice something from it's "natural" toolset to cap efficiency (speed/damage) of using "not-natural" skill.

Make these weapons equippable by professions who need them.

Yes, please no weapons locked to particular prof. Just balance requirements in way any prof shall made tradeof when making choice between "natural" and "un-natural" weapon.

Don't
Add weapons with split AR
Add weapons only those with perk/symb support can equip but which are obviously much worse (useless weapon theorum)

Absolutey disagree - someone who invested more IP (split AR) or sacrificed possibility to hotswap (perk/symb support) shall have advantage against one who didn't.
Look at top froob-friendly weapons - DKP, Div9, Nophex, Techtronica Neural Disruptor (haven't melee toons, so giving only ranged samples) - these ones split AR and so better that weapons requiring single weap skill + single special. Idea of split > single was implemented in AO from the start, but unfortunately SL and AI mostly failed to follow it.

[Smasherr]

Threads like these make me not want to reactivate my main account. Instead of actually meaningful threads about making ACs count, doubling player health or whatever, about the fact that AO Classic's pvp is far superior to nowaday's and so on... blah, I'll just ignore most of you.

[crattey]

Definitely NO - there are specials "natural" for each prof - AS for agent, FA for sold, Burst for Fixer, Fling for advy, etc. Any prof shall sacrifice something from it's "natural" toolset to cap efficiency (speed/damage) of using "not-natural" skill.

This is bull****. AS is a requirement for crats and traders as much as it is for agents. This has nothing to do with their 'natural' preference, this has everything to do with FC never giving them viable alternatives.

Fixers have fling, burst and FA.
Advies have FA, SA, dimach, brawl. Or, they have fling, burst and FA.
Soldiers have FA and burst, fling too if they choose to dual wield.

Yes, please no weapons locked to particular prof. Just balance requirements in way any prof shall made tradeof when making choice between "natural" and "un-natural" weapon.

Once again, wrong. Crats and engis, for example, already have the lowest AS base skill in game. A good 160 lower than advies, fixers or traders for example. Making them perform depending on your level of skills once again screws over the support profs because they have the lowest base skill and no support for it.

Absolutey disagree - someone who invested more IP (split AR) or sacrificed possibility to hotswap (perk/symb support) shall have advantage against one who didn't.
Look at top froob-friendly weapons - DKP, Div9, Nophex, Techtronica Neural Disruptor (haven't melee toons, so giving only ranged samples) - these ones split AR and so better that weapons requiring single weap skill + single special. Idea of split > single was implemented in AO from the start, but unfortunately SL and AI mostly failed to follow it.

Wrong again. Very. We can't the reach the same levels of skill. Not because we skim on ip, but because we simply can't raise it as high as for the aforementioned profs.
Also, we can't use Artillery symbs, meaning weapons with split reqs aren't effective due to conflicting slots on implants.

Base AS skills on solitus 220:

Agent: 1294
Sol: 1134
Advie: 1134
Fixer: 974
Engi: 814
Crat: 814


Now, FC never gave us viable weapons/nanos or anything as an alternative to AS. We don't use it because we are so awesome with AS weapons, we use it because there simply isn't a viable alternative. If new AS weapons are going to be implemented, they should be implemented for those professions that currently lack PvP weaponry, and should be adjusted to allow them to use it effectively.