Originally Posted by
avo345
Are we really comparing the ability to blow through a 10K coon with 1 FA to reducing damage under AMS?
Let's compare:
Changing coon back to what it was means that it will take (against a prof like an advy @ current HP), something like 2.5 FAs to burn through it, assuming you land enough bullets each time. On an enf, if they end up reducing their HP enough, it'll take 1-2.
Taking damage under AMS at the moment, even assuming your opponent is using FA (so 15K cap) and only 87% reflect, results in: 1950 damage taken. If THAT change is rolled back, so that reflects apply after the cap, then, assuming 23K hp (a solid average between soli and trox SMG/AR setups), you take: 897 damage.
Assuming I did all these calculations correctly (if I've interpreted the changes correctly...I've only been playing for 2+ years, so I'm not entirely familiar with the systems in place before then), then soldiers avoid 6K damage over the life of an AMS from FA. Of course, there's only one prof that's using a 11s capped FA consistently in PVP....any guesses? Even adding in how other damage would be affected by this, say you avoid 10K damage (FA+burst+perks). Right now, with AMS the way it is, that barely makes a difference. Not many professions attack you under AMS, and even fewer can truly reduce your HP. Between battle prepared kits, stims, perks, and HD, the only professions that really take a decent amount of HP out are shades/MA. And neither profession really bothers doing anything to AMS right NOW, why would they after the changes?
Now, let's look back at coon again. Coon is a little bit different in its application than AMS. All the professions that have access to it have at least moderate self healing abilities, bar engies. Let's ignore engies at the moment, since we're in the soldier forum and a loss to an engineer is expected. So, that leaves advies, enforcers, and keepers. Now, you may ask, why is coon not the same as AMS? After all, both abilities give significant damage mitigation abilities over a short period of time. The difference is the healing ability. When soldiers' AMS run out, they have 40 seconds of defenselessness. That means that professions who are waiting out the AMS know they have 40 seconds to take down the soldier with out any worry that their damage would be for naught. A good soldier can survive a couple AMS downtimes, especially against a profession like a keeper or enforcer, but not against professions like MAs/shades/(good) adventurers, etc.
Meanwhile, against coon, from the viewpoint of a soldier, you MUST burn through the coon in order to damage the character using it. Why? Because if you simply try to ignore coon, much like other professions ignore AMS, then you not only give the opponent the 30 seconds to heal up, but they also retain their healing abilities once it has run out. They are NOT left defenseless. Could you imagine just spotting enforcers 30 seconds right now? You'd have no chance. Leaving an adventurer 30 seconds while not damaging them is laughable. An adventurer is a tough fight as it is; give them 30 seconds of free time and you might as well alt+f4. If you're not able to get through coon in a reasonable amount of time and cause at least a little damage, you're in trouble. Changing coon to take into account the 30% cap means, as outlined above, that advies could take 2-3 10+ bullet FAs, keepers could take 2 or so, and enforcers, depending on their HP situation, could take anywhere from .5-1.5 (who knows how their HP will end up after this rebalance). Enforcers may not end up being THAT much different for a soldier, but there is the potential. The simple fact of the matter remains, though, that it will definitely make a significant difference against keepers and adventurers - one that might make keepers a much more difficult fight than they are at the moment (not a bad thing) and totally destroy our already slim chances against an adventurer (a very bad thing). Not the greatest news to a profession that already has, in my opinion, few 'easy' fights in BS without AS.
With coon being the different animal that it is, compared to AMS, there's no way you can compare coon changes to reflect changes. Although it is obviously difficult to imagine how the AAO/AAD and healing systems will work once all the changes have gone through, we can only speculate from the current state of things, and going back to the old ways will result in further disadvantages for soldiers - the only profession in the game that relies on a short term defense followed by COMPLETE lack of defense (hell, you even get 10s of 0% reflect if you're truly unlucky).
As for all those who say, "Well, you already can't kill an adventurer/engi, enfos are already close, and keepers meh," keep in mind: this rebalancing act is not about keeping the status quo. ESPECIALLY, using an argument like "well, you can't kill xxx prof anyway" is not a good way to go about these changes. While a soldier v. engineer discussion can use that, since the engineer is an appropriate nemesis prof, I don't like the idea of saying that adventurers are impossible for a soldier already, so who cares what happens?