Newb Doc - Questions on early IP spending.

[________________Xoki]

Hi everyone! I'm new to Docs (and new to AO) and had a few questions on IPs. I didn't want to waste any and have to use up my reset points later, so I was wondering...

(Nanomage using Pistols, btw. No guild or twinkage)

Should I raise every ability every level? (Except maybe for strength?)

Focus on Dodge-Rng and Evade-ClsC? Or just one? Or neither?

I hate being slow, but don't want to waste too many points on Runspeed if raising it every level will leave me short somewhere else... is there a certain point I should stop?

Aside from what's mentioned, I've also been raising Matter Metamorphasis, Bio Metamorphasis, NanoC. Init., Ranged. Init., and Pistol every level.

Am I doing ok so far?
Thanks for your time.

[_______________Hypos]

Here's a nice thread on the topic from March: Starting a doc...

Oddly, I checked the sticky thread and didn't see a link for IP allocation. Need to get one in there.

[Kwuack]

Welcome to the Doc profession Zaveth.

It wasnt that long ago that i posted a similar question like yours.
Here's what i learned in the mean time. I hope it helps.

ip expenditure in the first 100 levels comes down to a single question, and that question is...
"Do i want to be a full healing doc or do i want to fight aswell".

I chose to be a full healing doc, so i'll give you my advise on that path... if you really want to go for fighting from the start... it is possible... but not easy. And since i have no experience with that, i will not advise you on it.

ok here goes.
Since you'll be a heal only doc, logically you should only raise skills needed for healing. And since you're healing abilities manifest themselves as nano's... all skills needed for this are found under the "Nano and Aiding" chapter of youre skills window.

It is a TOP priority to max these skills at all levels.
Bio Metamorphosis
Mat Metamorphosis
Time&Space
First Aid
Treatment.

Bio met and Mat Met are INT/PSY skills and thus the only abilities you should max to get the full effect is Intelligence and Psychic.
All the other abilities can lag a bit behind but INT and PSY are also top priorities. (healing skills wise).

To be able to cast youre heals quickly, you should also max out Nanoc. Init. The faster you cast, the more you heal. It's as simple as that.

But to cast all these heals you need nano points. And the bigger youre nano pool... the more heals you can cast. the only skill that determines how big you're nano pool is , is nano pool. So always max this. (to be found under the "abilities" tab)

So now you know what to raise to keep alive other people. Now here's what you need to keep yourself alive...

The more healthpoints you have... The more Damage you can absorb. The ONLY skill that determines youre health points is body development. so ALWAYS max this. (Because stamina is the only ability needed for body dev. make sure that stamina doesnt lag to far behind INT and PSY)

The higher you "evades" are (found under the speed tab)... the less you will get hit. If you're only fighting computer run mobs.. you will only need "evade clsc" and "dodge ranged attacks". But you definitly need them both.
it is commonly advised to keep youre evades at 2,5 times the level of the mobs youre fighting. But you will soon find out you dont have the ip to keep them there. Just keep these as high as possible.

so in orde of importance... here are the skills you need to pay attention to.

Mat Met
Bio Met
T&S
first Aid
Treatment
Nanoc Init.
Nano pool
body Dev
Int
Psy
Sta
evade clsc
dodge rngd

and here are a few other you can always raise with some left over ip's you might have (wont be much for the first 100 lvl's )

Comp Lit
Run speed
Sense
and any others i forgot...

One more tip... If you have the mental power to hang to all those ip's you will have left at first... (i think most people just give in to the temptation... ) ... It really pays to hang on to them.
I would advise to wait untill atleast lvl 85 to start thinking about things like Pharma tech... or other tradeskills... Be patient. Not giving in to the temptation of foolish ip spending will reward you greatly when you reach 100...

I hope this helps

[M@hdi]

Nice post Kwuack

Just a few sidenotes,

When ip gets crunchy remember that 1,5 to 2 times the QL of the missions you run in evade and dodge are usually enough top survive those missions. You don't want to be sucking up damage anyways

Also (and I will get flamed for this) bodydev doesn't add too much HP for mages like us, you can loosen up on that for a few levels if you need the ip elsewhere. Keep it high, but no real need to max every lvl (=12 hp).

One skill I didn't see in Kwuack's post is Agility. For me this always was my 4th most important ability for implant and armor reasons (trickle also helps ts a bit). I always found it a good to have skill

-mah

[Kwuack]

Thanks Mahdi

And indeed i agree with youre assesments...
Agility is not to be forgotten... And no worries necessary when you cant get you're evades to extreme levels... 2*mob level will certainly suffise.

But not completely on the body dev subject... In my opinion every extra point of health you can have helps... Indeed it will always be low...
But i dont think that that's a reason to let it slip under anything then max. And by sticking to only the necessary skills... i never had any trouble keeping it maxed anyways. so i never gave it a second's thought.

[M@hdi]

With my last doc those points went into shotgun, flingshot and aimed shot so I was kinda crunched all the way through :x

You are right when you see every point of HP counts. Every high level player will have tons of stories about "how they zoned down/out with 0 or 1 HP left" but in my experience playing the healdoc, skipping it one or 2 levels does not do any real harm. However, you are probably right

-mah (closing in on 1K posts)

[________________Xoki]

Thanks for all the help! I think I have a little better understanding now.

I've read all the weapons threads a few times over, and I know that for non-PvP most recommend to ignore weapons altogether until 100+.

Since I'm new though, I'd like to do a little exploring and soloing on my own. If I keep Ranged Init and Pistol up to a decent level, will it kill me on the IP department? I dont' really care to go the MA route.

Maybe I should just start and Adventurer instead, but I really want to be a Doc.

[Kwuack]

All i can say about that is the following.

My doc is my main and it was my first real character. (i started out with a fixer but dropped him at level 20 )

And at around lvl 45 i noticed i had a lot of ip left. (since i was only spending them on healing skills alone). i could either increase some of the abilities i didnt max (agil, stam , sense)... or do something else with them. And i decided to start with pharma tech since the money came in handy. and also wanted some fighting skills so i started upping MA. I was able to max pharma tech and Martial arts (didnt have anything left to put in brawling though) at the time but at lvl 70 i didnt have the ip left to keep upping either of those two skills. i was using ALL my ip to keep my healing maxed... (at that time i could have really used those saved up ip's for things like comp lit, run speed and the like). But i didnt have that reserve... and i regretted upping my MA and pharma tech skill at that time. i use them NOW... but back then it was just way to soon. It's better to wait untill you're over 100 to start thinking about stuff like that. Just focus on healing and nothing else... you'll need all those saved ip's at around lvl 75.


Bottom Line? (talking under lvl 100 here) If you want to be totally maxed on the healing department... You wont have enough ip left to keep two other skills maxed. (it will "seem" like you have a sea of ip's left... but that comes back to haunt you twenty-some levels later )
Maybe just one skills would be possible. But if you want to keep two other skills maxed, you'll eventually run out of ip's. and then you'll have to make a choice... More damage? or more healing?

to put it real short.
good healing and no good damage... enough ip's
no good healing and good damage... enough ip's
good healing and good damage... Must be another game because it aint gonna work in AO

once you're level 100... you'll be more experienced and so you will know automatically what you want to do with those extra ip's. And thus you will spend them more wisely.

there is no right or wrong answer for the whole "fighting or no-fighting doc" question... But whatever you decide for yourself. Make sure you'll stick to it. once you start on a certain road. It's best to keep on that road untill you're 100. and then think about a change.

[jamesfaust]

I've been maxing body dev on my baby doc. Reason is that if you look at the buff matrices, we can buff more hp than an enf all the time.

This might be a reason for most to NOT max out on their hp, but right now, I've been generally running 2-person missions with a friend of mine (crat), so I'm the tank. So far, my Nanomage Doc has been keeping near to my old Trox enf in hp. I have maybe 100-200 less than that char (but that char is also twinked to canada and back). So, I for one am a believer in the max out body dev, and being a fighting doc (the nanomage is an MA doc). IP is getting a little tight now, I have only 7k banked at level 31, and it seems like I'm going to have to start making a few sacrifices soon (33 or so).

What I max each level is:
Everything in the Abilities tab besides Sense (which I've only neglected for the last couple of levels)
Martial Arts
Brawl
All nano skills besides Sense Imp (Which I've only neglected for the last couple of levels)
First Aid
Treatment
NanoC Init

Other skills:
I have about 80ish in evade CC and ranged
Parry of 80ish
Comp lit 125
Physical init of 65ish (maybe less, I can't quite recall)
Pharma Tech of 30ish

Note: These are post implant scores


These are the ONLY places I've put points at all. The Doc has his top heals for his level (and not planning on letting that slip in the future), dishes more damage in PvM at the moment than anyone but an equal level Martial Artist, and has nearly the hp of an Enf. It's been a great road to 31 so far, and the cool part about the whole thing is that the character isn't anywhere near twinked. I just have normal stuff on him (I have QL30 imps in, and I don't even wear armor really). The crat and I can take missions turned nearly all the way up, and they are not only doable, but they're very easy too. I'm very much looking forward to my title caps coming up in 10 or so levels so that I can even out all my skills by 50. I think by about 70ish, following this same pattern, I'll start having a surplus of IP.



/Scrapx

[________chirurgienne]

I want to start a doc but if i go full healer what will happen without any fighting skills when i leave the newbie area, will i be able to find teams at lvl 3 or 4 ?

I find it almost impossible that i will be able to do solo mission without some fight skills . So my real question is how you full healers have managed to lvl without fighting skills?

thx for answers

[____________LtBurlap]

for the low lvls i recomend putting points into MA

its cheap, and you dont have to max the init skill, as long as you are going full agg then you will hit 1/1 without spending a point in phys init. as a doc your battles will be long afairs since your damage is low and your effective hp is VERY high (effective hp = real hp + amount you can heal) so dont expect to fly through missions like you can with an enf. only put more points into MA as needed, if you arnt hitting, or arnt hitting hard enough to take down the mob before you run out of nano then up your MA

After about lvl 20 i would stop bothering with MA and just start teaming. its far easier on the IP that way.


for more info on weapon skills look here

[Zanthyna]

The hardest 10 levels for a doc are level 5 - 15. (of course I say this in jest, but it does feel that way). You are too high to kill mobs without raising some attack skill, but you are too low to find a team with much sucess. I've found that post people solo until their mid teens because the first few levels pass by so fast it really isn't worth it to look for a team. If you don't want to raise MA or a weapons skill, you can try going to the Subway and looking for people in your range to team with.

[Nnoying]

I'm a Solitus doc with shotgun, now lvl 119, but it still comes down to the same thing for levels 1-120, at least, if you only plan on doing healing.

Every level, max all of your abilities (EVERYTHING) and body dev and nano pool. then go max nano init. then max BM MM TS and MC First aid and Treatment. Also max Comp lit and Nano prog. then for the first few levels also max Map navig.

Most people are probably going wtf? let me explain...

Maxing all of your abilities makes it SOOOO much easier to put implants in. Everybody will tell you to max int psy sta, but the problem is that int and psy are not very buffable for putting in good implants, whereas str and sta are, and so is agility (with FG from agents). Sense is still ok, with +15 agent buff, but if worst comes to worst, you can let sense lag behind especially during the IP crunches before you get a new TL. body dev = hp = you live. nano pool = more healing = you and others live.
nano init = faster heals = everybody lives

You will notice how I have not raised evades at all. This is not entirely true, I have raised them a BIT, same as runspeed. I have found that with good armor, but especially with a good team (read: enforcer) I don't have to worry too much about getting critted on. Now, I'm solitus so I have a few more HP than you, but I find that with health implanted and with all my normal buffs and other items you'll find, I can take the beating and heal myself long enough to not have to worry about evades, at least for these levels....

Comp lit: u need 251 to do BS missions and you want that as soon as possible. Also you want more to get better ncu stuff for a) more buffs and b) higher ql ncu items like %cost reducers. Also, higher comp lit makes things at shop cheaper, things like yalms ) but also nano rechargers which trust me you will buy tons of.

Nano prog?????? Very easy for docs to raise (light blue) You can make most of your own implants (except for shiny clusters usually) so saves $$$ on tipping for having them made. Also your only viable source of cash which u need to buy your chargers Its the only tradeskill that really scales well with level, i.e, you'll always find somebody who needs like 400 np for an implant, of 250, or 500 whatever, not like pharma and the other tradeskills where you see requests for like 900 skill I strongly recommend you invest in this skill, you'll find its well worth it.

Then nano skills pretty obvious. BM MM of course. TS is used in the team hp buff and also for nano rechargers so of course u max that. MC is not as crucial, it can lag during IP crunch, as you only need it for DoTs and other nanos you won't need as often as heals and team hp.

Map navig: get it to 25, then 50, then 80 to get the map upgrades, it will make your life sooo much easier, especially the people one (maybe thats 120 not sure) that way you can keep track of where your team is in a mission. After that don't touch it again.

So to sum up. Raise all those skills mentioned above. When the going gets tough in terms of ip, you can fall behind in sense, MC, map navig, nano prog and complit, probably in that order.

What about weapon skills you say? If you are going pistols roll yourself 2 Old English pistols ql 1 and dual wield them for + 10 int. If you go shotgun get a low level Krutt Fadango for similar buff "( you will need wrangles maybe temp implants to put it on). If you really want to do damage as a doc, use your nukes. I recently got my hands on First Degree Burns and its LOTS of fun

Anyways, I apologize for the lengthy rant nature of this post, but its a lot of stuff to sum up I hope it helps!

--Nnoying

[Sweede]

Been soloing my doc to 31, not twinked at all, well i custom made a set of ql20 implants when i made him, time to upgrade i guess

Can solo missions fairly easy, not full hard but around 70-75% or so, unless dogs, they hurt a lot

Nanos i use are
init debuff: Phantom weight.
Single target heal: Restorarative boost,Cursory examination.
Team heal: Team healing.
Team hp buff: Metabolism booster.
Short duration single target hp buff: Health surge.
DoT's: Cancerous burrower, Minor consuming toxin(and taint wounds from alchemist).
HoT's: Active remedy.
Nuke: Shatter bone
Other stuff: Enlarge, Specialist treatment.

All in all i think i have a good combo of healing power and dmg dealing, died once in the last few levels and that was in the temple being trained with 3 or 4 cutltists while fighting 2, did go out of nano so could not heal.

Things i max are body dev, nano pool, treatment/first aid, bm,mm, stuff i try to keep up comp lit, other nano skills like mc,ts, psychic(for more nano), stamina(for more hp), other skills to be able to use better armor, shotgun, some on chemistry and pharma tech, those bloodplasma can give some nice cash.

At 31 i self buff my hp to around 1040 and nano is 1-1.2k'ish.

Think my doc is becoming a lot of fun.

[Obsoleet]

I chose the path of pistol wielding Nanomage Doctor and im running towards lvl 50.

The attributes I max every level are these:
- Stamina (for imps & HP trickledown)
- Intelligence (Nano skills & Nano Pool) - Max
- Psychic (Delta tick & Nano Pool) - Max
- Body Dev (for HP) - Max
- Nano Pool (self explanatory) - Max

Other skills:
- Nano C.Init (the faster I can cast my heals the better) - Max
- Evades when possible (less crit/hit chance = lasting longer)
- Comp.Lit (need I explain?) - Max
- Treatment (...) - Max

Nano skills:
BM - MM - PM - MC (Max), others I find slightly less important.
With these Nano skills I'm sure I can cast the best debuffs, Heals and DoTs.

Most important for me to max at every level will always be Int, Psy, Nano Pool and mentioned Nano skills.
Others come in second place should I have to choose when IP gets tight.

[Mauurie]

Excellent post Kwuack

The only thing I disagre with is the complit. After maxing bm/mm/pm I'd go for complit. Complit and space for bigger hp buff beats more body dev all over. And when you run out of bigger hp buffs to cast, you got the ip to max body dev.

[ClockworkD]

Impressive necro.

[Regidoc]

gawd, this is 3 year old necro. Getting this shut down.

[Sabynne]

Closed for Necromancy.